Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

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smurphy   10 W

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by smurphy » Dec 30 2019 4:26am

Yesterday my first off road trip with the 24F. Previous controllers on my Q76R/qs205: Adaptto Max-E and Sabvoton 72150. The NUC's are a major shift in high power e-bikes. All the setting you want in a small controller. The power is amazing/smooth/crazy, configurable from "baby mode" to "totally out of this world". 30% more battery/range and motor and controller just stay cool. Now that's a efficient controller! And believe me, we abuse our bikes big time. Look at the video where Vasily shorts the phase wires. All the toasted controllers have died a second time! If you have a + 4K watt e-bike: dump your controller and get a NUC. This thing has secret sauce inside. The russians did it again. Vasily=God Basta.
Qulbix Q76R QS205 Sabvoton 72150, Qulbix Q76R, QS205 Max-E. Bafang BBSHD. 14S6P GA pack. Zero DSR 2016.

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by macribs » Dec 30 2019 10:32am

Allex wrote:
Dec 29 2019 6:00pm
Just got got my controller from Moscow that I sent to them. Guys fitted 24F Nuc inside.
Thx team Nucular!

Image

Wooow. That is sooo cool. That must be the coolest Sur Ron upgrade I've seen. For sure.

And getting the 24F mounted inside the stock controller box is perfect for all of us that got the sur run with L1E EU license plate :D :D :D

Looks stock, license plate and pink slip says moped but the controller says at least EU A1 with a decent tune up. :D

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Allex » Dec 30 2019 3:49pm


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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by macribs » Dec 30 2019 4:33pm

:thumb: 4 sharing the pics Allex

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Offroader » Dec 30 2019 9:58pm

Allex, can I do this sur ron controller swap myself?

Like by removing the old controller out of the aluminum housing and screwing in the 24f nuclear?

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by PITMIX » Dec 31 2019 7:27am

The mosfets have been flattened. You have to becareful not to break legs.
Aixam 550 Twin retrophite Qs 138 70H, Thermo-Nucular electronics 24F, LG Chem 20s 60Ah

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Allex   1 GW

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Allex » Dec 31 2019 12:28pm

Offroader wrote:
Dec 30 2019 9:58pm
Allex, can I do this sur ron controller swap myself?

Like by removing the old controller out of the aluminum housing and screwing in the 24f nuclear?
You can ask them ship it with fets soldered in the way so it suits sur ron casing and in this case they have to send their controller case unmounted.

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Offroader » Dec 31 2019 12:35pm

Alex, do you know how easy it is to remove the surron controller out of the housing? I know its potted in there.

After removing the surron controller from the housing i just need to tap holes to bolt the nuclear controller into the case? I guess a hole for each fet?

Do you know if you can put the stock controller back in the sur ron housing if you remove it?

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by macribs » Dec 31 2019 9:24pm

Allex wrote:
Dec 31 2019 12:28pm
Offroader wrote:
Dec 30 2019 9:58pm
Allex, can I do this sur ron controller swap myself?

Like by removing the old controller out of the aluminum housing and screwing in the 24f nuclear?
You can ask them ship it with fets soldered in the way so it suits sur ron casing and in this case they have to send their controller case unmounted.
I am so impressed by how Nuclear meets their customers requests. This is just awesome. What a fantastic company. I really hope they can stick to their guns as the company continues to grow, that will for sure set them apart from the run of the mill controller companies.

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by ElectricGod » Jan 01 2020 5:04am

Allex wrote:
Dec 29 2019 6:31pm
Around 140USD for building it in.
Worth it for me, because it is plug and play, screw on using original mounts without hassling with new mounts and besides, it looks stock even though it is tuned!
This bike is so sick now! Belt drive and 12kW pops wheelies just like that at 50km/h
Tops at around 100km/h did not have time to experiment much with settings yet though.
16s13p 30q pack in original battery casing too!

It will be brutal with 20s
It probably won't accelerate any better than it does now if you don't also change the gearing.
Your motor torque will not change at 82v vs 66v.
What will change is your top speed will now be a bit higher.
I have no idea how much higher since I don't know your motor Kv.
You can trade a bit of that top speed if you need more torque at the back wheel.
Just gear a little further away from 1:1.
It's fairly surprising how much you get out of dropping a single tooth from the motor sprocket.
XB-502: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=83302&p=1222730#p1222730

Currie scooter: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=83830&p=1227407#p1227407

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by madin88 » Jan 01 2020 7:32am

ElectricGod wrote:
Jan 01 2020 5:04am
It probably won't accelerate any better than it does now if you don't also change the gearing.
Your motor torque will not change at 82v vs 66v.
What will change is your top speed will now be a bit higher.
I have no idea how much higher since I don't know your motor Kv.
You can trade a bit of that top speed if you need more torque at the back wheel.
Just gear a little further away from 1:1.
It's fairly surprising how much you get out of dropping a single tooth from the motor sprocket.
With 20s battery it will accelerate quicker, not from a stand still, but above a given speed the motor torque will be higher because phase amps do not drop off as fast as they do with 16s battery. You know, the thing with BEMF?

Allex was talking about Surron a few posts earlier, so kV and gearing is known (belt drive is fixed btw, and there even was a Dyno test published), but it is nothing new that you almost never read what others wrote.
Last edited by madin88 on Jan 02 2020 5:42am, edited 1 time in total.

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macribs   1.21 GW

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by macribs » Jan 02 2020 4:02am

Keep things civil please.

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ElectricGod   1 GW

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by ElectricGod » Jan 02 2020 8:11pm

macribs wrote:
Jan 02 2020 4:02am
Keep things civil please.

That's what I would prefer too.
There's zero point in deliberately undermining people.
No point in it at all...giant waste of everyone's time.
IMHO...it's completely unproductive in every way.
XB-502: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=83302&p=1222730#p1222730

Currie scooter: viewtopic.php?f=35&t=83830&p=1227407#p1227407

Benjamin Franklin - "Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do."

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by VasiliSk » Jan 03 2020 5:49pm

Hello guys, im on holidays with my family, i will reply everyone later. Hope you have good time too and happy new year!

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Ohbse » Jan 04 2020 6:39pm

ElectricGod wrote:
Jan 02 2020 8:11pm
macribs wrote:
Jan 02 2020 4:02am
Keep things civil please.
That's what I would prefer too.
There's zero point in deliberately undermining people.
No point in it at all...giant waste of everyone's time.
IMHO...it's completely unproductive in every way.
And yet there is a point - you were mistaken, it was explained why you were mistaken - disinformation was corrected and the community profits from this. Allex softened the tone of his post, but he was understandably frustrated as you often post from a position of absolute authority, however may not have perfect understanding of the topic at hand. Be gracious in accepting new knowledge and continue to provide the excellent content you have been posting - I for one appreciate your efforts.

Back on topic - I received my 24f Nucular kit with the surron connectors. I gutted the stock controller and fitted the Nucular inside, trimming back the plastic cover to retain the appearance of a completely stock controller when fitted to the bike. Everything fits perfectly and with some minimal setup I was up and running. This controller is incredibly impressive - I am very pleased with the purchase and highly impressed with the support received from Vasily and the community on the telegram channel. This is dramatically better than the Adaptto that I was so fond of and by all accounts a great deal more reliable. Finally a controller that offers the full package! With the upcoming addition of the BMS functionality it will be perfect.

Top speed on completely stock L1E spec surron was 65km/h, I replaced the chain with the Luna Belt kit - this increased top speed to 72km/h (though at the expense of torque). Top speed with Nucular with the 90a battery limit (to avoid BMS tripping) is ~80km/h. Acceleration at lower speeds significantly improved. Noise significantly reduced. Loving it!

Next steps are to set up a left hand input for the regen braking, build an auxiliary 16s10p battery to connect in parallel and then I will be able to really dial up the power and unleash its full capability. Right now it feels very strangled by the 90a battery limit!

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Offroader » Jan 04 2020 9:18pm

Ohbse, did you order your 24Fet controller specifically to fit inside Sur-Ron controller?

Was there any issues with gutting the Sur-ron stock controller? What do you mean trimming back the plastic pieces?
Would you be able to put back your sur-ron original controller in the sur-ron housing if you needed to?

How did you attach the Nuclear 24fet controller inside the Sur-Ron housing? Did you have to drill and tap screw holes?

Thanks, I just wish there was more information on how to install this controller into a Sur-Ron controller housing.

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Merlin   10 MW

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Merlin » Jan 04 2020 9:32pm

What's the benefit of doing this on your Offroad surron?
No one ever had the idea on adapttos.

The nuc fits well in front of the surron. Why hide it?

Even the legal l1e... If they stop you it's "probably" not because your controller... More likely because you took a deep flight on the street :lol:

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Offroader » Jan 04 2020 9:40pm

I see your point, but I really like the look of the stock Sur-Ron controller. It says Sur-Ron on it and doesn't look like a generic controller case mounted to the front of the bike.

Look at this sur-ron bike its pure beauty. The black Sur-Ron housing which says Sur-Ron on it and the X through it just adds the to beauty of the bike.

Image

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Ohbse » Jan 04 2020 10:55pm

Offroader wrote:
Jan 04 2020 9:18pm
Ohbse, did you order your 24Fet controller specifically to fit inside Sur-Ron controller?

Was there any issues with gutting the Sur-ron stock controller? What do you mean trimming back the plastic pieces?
Would you be able to put back your sur-ron original controller in the sur-ron housing if you needed to?

How did you attach the Nuclear 24fet controller inside the Sur-Ron housing? Did you have to drill and tap screw holes?
I did not order it as per Allex with the PCB mounted internally, I just mounted the standard housing to the surron heatsink plate. I cut the plastic portion of the housing away except for the edges so that from the side it appears stock. I added an aluminum spacer underneath the controller housing with thermal grease to couple the controller to heatsink. I drilled and tapped 4 m5 holes to mount using the controller brackets.

Gutting the housing was actually quite challenging. The stock controller is potted in epoxy, I had to boil it to soften the potting and remove with a flat blade implement. Inside are two stacked pcbs. I gave up doing this non destructively pretty quickly. I had no interest in reuse of the stock controller, given that it was not the X version.

Reason I did it is to increase cooling, retain the stock appearance as well as the weather proofing.

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by larsb » Jan 05 2020 4:51am

What is the achievable stall current (at zero rpm, locked motor / standstill) with the Nucular 12 and 24fet?

I am asking since this really is a key performance factor for the hotrodding people.
Ride on!

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by John in CR » Jan 05 2020 1:22pm

larsb wrote:
Jan 05 2020 4:51am
What is the achievable stall current (at zero rpm, locked motor / standstill) with the Nucular 12 and 24fet?

I am asking since this really is a key performance factor for the hotrodding people.
I'm pretty sure you can play around with the settings related to the "clutch" function to achieve launches as hard as you wish, though it will likely require the 24fet version depending on the power level you need. The issue with all my builds since 2012 has been nearly uncontrollable launches and/or low speed issues, but now with Nucs those issues are completely solved because Vasily has given us so much control over tuning everything he and the beta testers could come up with. With it in torque mode, not only can you tune how fast current ramps up through the throttle voltage ramp time limits, but you can also control the maximum safe rpm ramp up too. Then on the flip side of that when you tune in a nice hard launch to your liking, you don't have to suffer with harsh regen braking because the regen current ramp up times are separately programmable. These are the controllers I've been anxiously wanting to come out for a decade.

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by larsb » Jan 05 2020 2:47pm

I’m still looking for the value :D
Ride on!

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Allex   1 GW

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Allex » Jan 05 2020 4:13pm

Offroader wrote:
Jan 04 2020 9:18pm
Ohbse, did you order your 24Fet controller specifically to fit inside Sur-Ron controller?

Was there any issues with gutting the Sur-ron stock controller? What do you mean trimming back the plastic pieces?
Would you be able to put back your sur-ron original controller in the sur-ron housing if you needed to?

How did you attach the Nuclear 24fet controller inside the Sur-Ron housing? Did you have to drill and tap screw holes?

Thanks, I just wish there was more information on how to install this controller into a Sur-Ron controller housing.
There is tons of info in nucs telegram channel with pictures on surron mounting. Install Telegram on the phone/computer and join! Not only that, you get instant help from the team or members.

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Ohbse » Jan 05 2020 5:04pm

John in CR wrote:
Jan 05 2020 1:22pm
larsb wrote:
Jan 05 2020 4:51am
What is the achievable stall current (at zero rpm, locked motor / standstill) with the Nucular 12 and 24fet?

I am asking since this really is a key performance factor for the hotrodding people.
I'm pretty sure you can play around with the settings related to the "clutch" function to achieve launches as hard as you wish, though it will likely require the 24fet version depending on the power level you need. The issue with all my builds since 2012 has been nearly uncontrollable launches and/or low speed issues, but now with Nucs those issues are completely solved because Vasily has given us so much control over tuning everything he and the beta testers could come up with. With it in torque mode, not only can you tune how fast current ramps up through the throttle voltage ramp time limits, but you can also control the maximum safe rpm ramp up too. Then on the flip side of that when you tune in a nice hard launch to your liking, you don't have to suffer with harsh regen braking because the regen current ramp up times are separately programmable. These are the controllers I've been anxiously wanting to come out for a decade.
Glad to hear you've finally got some good controllers in play John! There have been a few options that are just as good as the Nuc for control, but as a complete package the Nucular is very difficult to beat. I didn't want to comment until I had some hands on experience, but this is easily the best controller option for enthusiasts by a long, long way.

Larsb - I believe it will do whatever you program it to do for stall torque. I was just experimenting on my surron and with rear brake on full I was able to get to ~300 phase amps until the brake gave way. This is not some cheap Kelly bullshit - it will do what you tell it to do, even if that's throwing you right off the bike.

For launching it's possible to configure an instant start by specifying a brake lever cutoff to act as throttle input disable. Set your throttle to whatever level, release the brake lever and bang - you'll be away very quickly.

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Re: Nucular electronics - complete kit for ev! [beta]

Post by Altair » Jan 05 2020 7:06pm

larsb wrote:
Jan 05 2020 2:47pm
I’m still looking for the value :D
I am also looking for the exact value. Is it the same as the max phase current, or less?

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