Step by step evolution of a 1st ebike conversion

General Discussion about electric bicycles.
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amberwolf   100 GW

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by amberwolf » Sep 16 2017 3:14am

That looks like a lot of light up above the "horizon" line (road surface). If so, I'd highly recommend some horizon-line shades or lenses/lids for those lights, so they aren't blinding everyone heading towards you.

It's courteous, and it could prevent a collision (either with something else in front of them they can't see because of the glare of the lights, or even with you because some people swerve towards things that blind them). It can also prevent pedestrians and other cyclists from being blinded and unable to see their own path (and potentially tripping or crashing, being injured or worse)

There's a lot of cars out there that i wish had such horizon-line shades, because they prevent me from being able to see even the road surface my own headlight is illuminating.

My own headlight is that off some Kia, because it does have a good horizon line in normal mode (I don't normally use it in "high beam" mode for the same reasons I mention above, but it's wired in in case I ever need it--I *have* used it to flick on momentarily for cars that are driving around with *their* HBs on, so they'll realize they're causing others to have problems seeing).

I've tried other lights, and for a few years I used some old 80's halogen headlights that also had a horizon, but the horizon wasn't sharp like the Kia light, and that bulb type didn't give a good even lighting from me to the horizon line down-road. Spot-type LED lights and flashlights and other lights (halogen spots, CFLs with lenses, etc) I tried all had the problem of not enough light where I needed it unless they were bright enough to cause problems with other people's vision.

Not that I'm suggesting the use of a car headlight...just the result it produces works well to illuminate the road without blinding anyone, so you could implement any idea that does the same thing. There've been some posts in threads about lighting that show a few ways, including mirrors above LEDs, etc.

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Wolfeman   100 W

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Jan 21 2018 2:49pm

So after approximately 2500 miles, my 52V 15aH HPC pack is showing some serious voltage sag and range is dropping. I've phoned and emailed HPC and they've asked me to send the pack in for repair/replacement. Before I do that though, I have to get a second pack since my bike is my daily commute vehicle. I've been researching and think I've decided on putting together a 14S 20aH Multistar pack. I have a Cellpro Powerlab 8 charger and a battery medic on order.
IMG_0973.jpg
IMG_0973.jpg (103.05 KiB) Viewed 2195 times
My hope is that the 20aH Multistar pack will be a great 2nd battery for when I eventually build a second bike.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

EbikeAus   100 W

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by EbikeAus » Feb 07 2018 10:45pm

Awesome thread!
Very useful for someone like myself just starting a build..

You will probably see some of the components you have used on my build :) Love those headlights. Are they just the led kind you find on ebay?
Thanks for sharing
Choose LiFe 8)

May all your batteries be fully charged and perfectly balanced :P

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Feb 08 2018 12:05pm

EbikeAus wrote:
Feb 07 2018 10:45pm
Awesome thread!
Very useful for someone like myself just starting a build..

You will probably see some of the components you have used on my build :) Love those headlights. Are they just the led kind you find on ebay?
Thanks for sharing
Hey Aus, I got them from Amazon, but similar ones are available on eBay. Thanks!
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Wolfeman   100 W

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Feb 08 2018 12:12pm

I finally gathered all the pieces to put together my second battery. I went with 16aH Multistars from HK and got them on sale. I went with a 14S set-up composed of 2 4S packs and one 6S pack. To series connect them I contacted West Coast Electric Cycles. https://westcoastelectrics.com Barrent was very responsive, made me a beautiful harness and shipped it very quickly. I was not able to use the previously shown charger, so ended up buying a Tenergy TB6B that I will use for balance charging. I am VERY happy with this set-up.
IMG_1021.jpg
IMG_1021.jpg (164.23 KiB) Viewed 2136 times
I plan on using my Luna 52V smart charger for bulk charging (while monitoring with Battery Medics), and balance charge with the Tenergy.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Wolfeman   100 W

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Mar 16 2018 10:51am

Got some more 6S Multistars on sale the other day and put together a 18S pack. Whoa... The acceleration from 10 mph to 30 mph is significant. Haven't had a chance to do a top speed run on level ground yet, but am thinking it'll probably max out around 42 to 43 mph.

[youtube]https://youtu.be/ex4MYtznEco/youtube]

I was very glad my controller didn't make smoke, and at 3000w, things stayed nice and cool.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

Philaphlous   1 kW

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Philaphlous » Mar 19 2018 7:41am

For me personally I can't stand the raised handlebars... I really like the flat look. Reminds me of a motorcycle...with those handlebars I'd imagine you look like a chpppa when riding...lol

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Mar 19 2018 6:54pm

Philaphlous wrote:
Mar 19 2018 7:41am
For me personally I can't stand the raised handlebars... I really like the flat look. Reminds me of a motorcycle...with those handlebars I'd imagine you look like a chpppa when riding...lol
Not sure what a chpppa is, but I don't really care how I look when I ride, I'm more concerned with being comfortable.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Wolfeman   100 W

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Mar 19 2018 7:14pm

So a second bike has joined the stable. A good friend passed away and his wife gave me his 2010 Trek Navigator 2.0. It's a nice relaxed posture aluminum frame that's VERY lightweight. While my 4300 has evolved into a great daily commuter bike, this Navigator seems like it would make a great light duty trail exploring bike with a BBSHD.
IMG_1272.jpg
Navigator and 4300
IMG_1272.jpg (130.46 KiB) Viewed 2002 times
I'm thinking about some beach cruiser style handlebars, a rear set seat post, some good Schwalbe knobby tires and a frame bag for the battery. Not looking to go fast on this one, I'd rather sit back and enjoy the scenery while being really comfortable and not worrying about range or about flat tires.
IMG_1273.jpg
Navigator rear 3/4 view
IMG_1273.jpg (124.74 KiB) Viewed 2002 times
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Jun 12 2018 9:40am

Been wanting some more power and traction lately so did some shopping. Ordered an 18 FET controller from Barent at West Coast Electric Cycles. The controller will add some great power and functionality to the bike. It has cruise control, regen, 3 speed switch and will bring my amperage up to 60A continuous /90A peak from my stock controller's 45A. I'm going to mount it in the same location as my existing one, but will need to rivnut the frame for secure mounting. I need to figure out handlebar switch mounting options that don't look too much like a motorcycle since I still want this thing to look like a mtn bike to passerbys.

IMG_1663.jpg
New WCEC 18 FET and Schwalbe tires
IMG_1663.jpg (110.18 KiB) Viewed 1832 times
For tires I went with Schwalbe Marathon Plus MTB 26" x 2.25". I haven't had a single flat with my existing Schwalbe street tires in over 1200 miles. The peace of mind is so worth the price.

I'm still running a 14S 16aH Multistar pack, but will rewiring for 20S at 16aH to take advantage of the new controller. Top speed on 14S is about 36 mph on the flats. I tried an 18S setup and topped out at about 43 mph. I'm anxious to see what 20S and more amperage will do. Definitely going to need to install a 2nd torque arm on the other side of the axle. Will be going with a Grin Tech V4. More pics when things are going together.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Wolfeman   100 W

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Jul 10 2018 12:08pm

Finally got around to doing some soldering/wiring. Expanded my 3 pack series harness to a 4 pack series harness and set up my 16aH 20S Multistar pack. Got it out for a test ride last night with my existing 45A controller hoping that it would handle the voltage. All went well, no smoke and top speed on a slight downhill was just over 50 mph. It'll be nice having the extra watt hours when I'm just cruising, finally have over 1kWh on board.
IMG_1725.jpg
Pack voltage at about 85% SOC
IMG_1725.jpg (93.25 KiB) Viewed 1765 times
IMG_1726.jpg
Top speed
IMG_1726.jpg (90.25 KiB) Viewed 1765 times
Looking forward to installing the new WCEC controller and gaining regen, cruise and 90A peak. More to come.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Jul 13 2018 3:19pm

Put the bike up on the work stand the other day and gave it a good cleaning and going through. Found and replaced a broken spoke on the front wheel, cleaned up wiring, checked brake pads, etc. While I was working on it, I also put on the new Schwalbe knobbies which I really like. Since the last update I've also put on lower bars, an adjustable kickstand and a new seat. Still running great with over 3300 miles so far.
IMG_1732.jpg
IMG_1732.jpg (113.98 KiB) Viewed 1743 times
This rear 3/4 view is one of my favorites for bikes and motorcycles.

IMG_1733.jpg
IMG_1733.jpg (117.99 KiB) Viewed 1743 times
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Re: Step by step evolution of a 1st ebike conversion

Post by pwd » Oct 15 2018 12:57pm

Nice build! I was wondering how the wcec controller is holding up? I ordered one for myself.
Commuter/Street Build viewtopic.php?f=6&t=98286:
Rocky Mountain Element
Magic Pie 4 front + Leafmotor 1500 rear w/ WCEC 18fet
Samsung 40T 14S7P

Offroad Build viewtopic.php?f=6&t=102195:
2019 Rocky Mountain Blizzard 20
Cyclone "3kw" 13T motor to 36T chain ring then 32T chain ring to 11T-46T Cassette
em3ev 14S5P 30Q or 14S6P 25R pack

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by dirt huffer » Oct 15 2018 9:41pm

Wolfeman wrote:
Mar 19 2018 7:14pm
While my 4300 has evolved into a great daily commuter bike, this Navigator seems like it would make a great light duty trail exploring bike with a BBSHD.
It's been nice following along with your upgrades. Just be careful offroading the Navigator. A lot of people have snapped those comfort bike suspension forks. They really can't handle much beyond pavement pounding

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Oct 18 2018 10:27am

dirt huffer wrote:
Oct 15 2018 9:41pm
Wolfeman wrote:
Mar 19 2018 7:14pm
While my 4300 has evolved into a great daily commuter bike, this Navigator seems like it would make a great light duty trail exploring bike with a BBSHD.
It's been nice following along with your upgrades. Just be careful offroading the Navigator. A lot of people have snapped those comfort bike suspension forks. They really can't handle much beyond pavement pounding
Yeah, I ended up selling the Navigator. Looking at buying an Electra 7D Lux and putting on a BBSHD for around town cruising and fun. The 4300 with the hub motor will probably get a new and better Rockshox for trail riding.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by dirt huffer » Oct 18 2018 11:03am

Wolfeman wrote:
Oct 18 2018 10:27am
The 4300 with the hub motor will probably get a new and better Rockshox for trail riding.
Much better choice! I've got an older Trek 7000 - same frame and geometry as your 4300, just nicer component specs. It's taken a real beating to the point where i'm simply amazed i haven't cracked any of the welds. I swapped the stock 80mm fork on it and put a 120mm fork and the handling improvement was hugely improved. IMO, the headtube angle on these older Trek XC bikes is way too steep. The newer forks are soooo much better than the old stuff

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Re: Step by step evolution of a 1st ebike conversion

Post by thundercamel » Oct 22 2019 4:20pm

Any updates? I enjoyed reading all of your build threads :)
My Ebike builds - Existing bikes, affordable motor kits, self built 14s6p batteries - Now with more recumbent!

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by E-HP » Oct 22 2019 6:53pm

Wolfeman wrote:
Feb 08 2018 12:12pm
I finally gathered all the pieces to put together my second battery. I went with 16aH Multistars from HK and got them on sale. I went with a 14S set-up composed of 2 4S packs and one 6S pack. To series connect them I contacted West Coast Electric Cycles. https://westcoastelectrics.com Barrent was very responsive, made me a beautiful harness and shipped it very quickly. I was not able to use the previously shown charger, so ended up buying a Tenergy TB6B that I will use for balance charging. I am VERY happy with this set-up.

I plan on using my Luna 52V smart charger for bulk charging (while monitoring with Battery Medics), and balance charge with the Tenergy.
Would you be able to share what the cost is for the lipo battery setup, including the necessary chargers, etc., for me to replicate something similar? I noticed in your post further down, your comment on the impact on acceleration, and although I may not want to use lipo regularly, I'm seeing more and more that it's a great way to mix and match and test a system at different voltage levels and current capabilities. I have a non-smart cheap 52v charger now, which may not be sufficient for this purpose, so I'm assuming I'll need to buy that as well.

My other question is, assuming I just use the lipos for testing, what would be their shelf life if not being used?

Thanks for any insights you'd be willing to provide. (I like tinkering, so I'd put this into a different category of costs...to convince myself I'm not spending a bunch on the ebike hobby; sort of like how I spend money on tools).

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by Wolfeman » Nov 05 2019 9:54am

E-HP wrote:
Oct 22 2019 6:53pm

Would you be able to share what the cost is for the lipo battery setup, including the necessary chargers, etc., for me to replicate something similar? I noticed in your post further down, your comment on the impact on acceleration, and although I may not want to use lipo regularly, I'm seeing more and more that it's a great way to mix and match and test a system at different voltage levels and current capabilities. I have a non-smart cheap 52v charger now, which may not be sufficient for this purpose, so I'm assuming I'll need to buy that as well.

My other question is, assuming I just use the lipos for testing, what would be their shelf life if not being used?

Thanks for any insights you'd be willing to provide. (I like tinkering, so I'd put this into a different category of costs...to convince myself I'm not spending a bunch on the ebike hobby; sort of like how I spend money on tools).
I'm sure prices have changed since I originally posted this. Pretty sure I posted enough detail to google that stuff. As far as shelf life on lipos, I can only speak from my experience which is that well maintained packs are still running strong after over a year of mostly consistent use. I balance charge each pack individually about every 5th or 6th bulk charge and monitor cell voltages with a battery medic regularly.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Wolfeman   100 W

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Re: Step by step evolution of a 1st ebike conversion

Post by Wolfeman » Nov 05 2019 10:02am

thundercamel wrote:
Oct 22 2019 4:20pm
Any updates? I enjoyed reading all of your build threads :)
The venerable Trek is currently partially disassembled. Had a problem with wiring up the new 90A controller and fried a hall sensor.
Trek 4300 w/ H3580 Crystalyte at 3600W
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=82738
Worksman Mover M2020-3CB w/DD 750W front hub
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=96873
Dyno Moto 7 BMX Cruiser w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&p=1467001#p1467001
GT Palomar Vintage hardtail w/BBS02
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=104255

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Re: Evolution of a 1st ebike....

Post by E-HP » Nov 06 2019 1:25am

Wolfeman wrote:
Nov 05 2019 9:54am
I'm sure prices have changed since I originally posted this. Pretty sure I posted enough detail to google that stuff. As far as shelf life on lipos, I can only speak from my experience which is that well maintained packs are still running strong after over a year of mostly consistent use. I balance charge each pack individually about every 5th or 6th bulk charge and monitor cell voltages with a battery medic regularly.
That's cool. I'm not in a hurry. I watched a few videos and filled in some missing pieces (mainly the power supply vs charger). Also I need to do a lot to research on what level of components to start with (something above entry level), and I'm thinking now is about time for me to put a shed in the backyard. :flame:

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