Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
Post Reply
User avatar
Ecyclist   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 360
Joined: Apr 01 2016 10:53pm
Location: San Diego, California

Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Ecyclist » Apr 01 2019 2:08am

Hi guys!
You can buy on Amazon small and big block motors with controllers.
Small is $99.99 and big is $139.97 both with free shipping.
https://www.amazon.com/VEVOR-Electric-B ... B07FBDCDZL
Motor on Amazon.jpg
Last edited by mark5 on Apr 01 2019 2:42am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Clean amzn link
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

StinkyGoalieGuy   100 W

100 W
Posts: 281
Joined: Apr 23 2008 3:53pm

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by StinkyGoalieGuy » Apr 04 2019 4:05pm

Nice find! What's that black section between the core and the output shaft? Planetary gearbox?

StinkyGoalieGuy   100 W

100 W
Posts: 281
Joined: Apr 23 2008 3:53pm

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by StinkyGoalieGuy » Apr 04 2019 4:11pm

StinkyGoalieGuy wrote:
Apr 04 2019 4:05pm
Nice find! What's that black section between the core and the output shaft? Planetary gearbox?
Answering my own question. If I expand out the listing, it mentions "Gear ratio: 6:1", so that must be a gearbox. I wonder if it would be easy to remove the gear reduction and that blue cover on the back which I assume is a fan. Otherwise, this would be too wide to fit in between the cranks.

User avatar
Ecyclist   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 360
Joined: Apr 01 2016 10:53pm
Location: San Diego, California

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Ecyclist » Apr 13 2019 10:28pm

Yes, you can take it all out. This is exactly the same motor that LR is selling for $250/$350 and that without a controller.
And you better be nice or he will not sell it to you. :shock:
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

devo1223   100 W

100 W
Posts: 232
Joined: Nov 06 2012 4:32pm
Location: Lake Tahoe,CA

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by devo1223 » Apr 16 2019 12:58am

Just bought mine thanks!
Vector lite stuffed with 30Qs
Mxus 3k turbo 3t in 17in moto rim
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=92531&p=1353484&hil ... e#p1353484

User avatar
Chalo   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 7961
Joined: Apr 29 2009 11:29pm
Location: Austin, Texas

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Chalo » Apr 16 2019 1:13am

Bigger than Cyclone 3kW and 2-4kW, with a lot less torque and a fraction of the power? What am I missing? Is the controller just a place holder for the real thing?
This is to express my gratitude to Justin of Grin Technologies for his extraordinary measures to save this forum for the benefit of all.

User avatar
Skaiwerd   100 W

100 W
Posts: 212
Joined: Jun 16 2016 4:55am
Location: CT

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Skaiwerd » Apr 16 2019 6:51am

People like cheap. You can experiment more when the price is right.

SlowCo   100 kW

100 kW
Posts: 1457
Joined: Jan 05 2015 5:43pm
Location: The Netherlands

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by SlowCo » Apr 16 2019 12:59pm

Those look great. What is the short time peak amps/power they can handle?

district9prawn   100 W

100 W
Posts: 286
Joined: Jul 20 2013 10:46pm
Location: Sydney

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by district9prawn » Apr 16 2019 11:39pm

Chalo wrote:
Apr 16 2019 1:13am
Bigger than Cyclone 3kW and 2-4kW, with a lot less torque and a fraction of the power? What am I missing?
If they are anything like the ones I bought for a similar price from aliexpress, there is a lot of empty space inside.

The stator height is the same as the cyclone 3k at 30mm. Air gap diameter is also the same. 10 magnets. From memory the phase to phase winding resistance is about 65 mohm.

This is what it looks like inside.

Image

Image
Neu 8057 6kW left hand drive hardtail with 18 fet Vesc: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=96754

User avatar
Ecyclist   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 360
Joined: Apr 01 2016 10:53pm
Location: San Diego, California

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Ecyclist » May 03 2019 3:09pm

Chalo wrote:
Apr 16 2019 1:13am
Bigger than Cyclone 3kW and 2-4kW, with a lot less torque and a fraction of the power? What am I missing? Is the controller just a place holder for the real thing?
Price and compactness. Both are very important for a light e-bike build. Now if you planning to build e-tractor Cyclone is a way to go. :)
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

SwampDonkey   100 W

100 W
Posts: 198
Joined: Mar 27 2018 1:35pm

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by SwampDonkey » May 04 2019 9:46pm

Its a clone of the cyclone (Denzel D4500) motors.

http://www.eastgem.net/d4500.html

User avatar
Ecyclist   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 360
Joined: Apr 01 2016 10:53pm
Location: San Diego, California

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Ecyclist » May 06 2019 11:46am

SwampDonkey wrote:
May 04 2019 9:46pm
Its a clone of the cyclone (Denzel D4500) motors.

http://www.eastgem.net/d4500.html
Chinese motors are all clones. With these motors it is impassible to tell which one is better because Chinese will cut corners every time they make something. Still for $100 with controller they might be worth the risk.
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

User avatar
amberwolf   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 30388
Joined: Aug 17 2009 6:43am
Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth, Sol, Local Bubble, Orion Arm, Milky Way, Local Group
Contact:

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by amberwolf » May 07 2019 12:45am

SwampDonkey wrote:
May 04 2019 9:46pm
Its a clone of the cyclone (Denzel D4500) motors.
or the cyclones are clones of something else, or both.

there are so many clones, and clones of the clones, etc. etc., of just about anything you can imagine, that unless you actually *know* "for sure" and/or have the original product, it's difficult to tell which is what and who is where and when. ;)

User avatar
Ecyclist   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 360
Joined: Apr 01 2016 10:53pm
Location: San Diego, California

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Ecyclist » May 07 2019 6:41pm

In China there is no way to tell what came first the egg or the chicken, unless it is a fake egg. These definitely come first and chickens are not part of the process. Check that out :shock: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvEBN8Jd5DE
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

User avatar
Chalo   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 7961
Joined: Apr 29 2009 11:29pm
Location: Austin, Texas

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Chalo » Jun 19 2019 2:04pm

So... who's used one of these motors, and how did it go?

They still have a few of the small "500W" ones left, though they're sold out of the big ones.
This is to express my gratitude to Justin of Grin Technologies for his extraordinary measures to save this forum for the benefit of all.

User avatar
Ecyclist   1 kW

1 kW
Posts: 360
Joined: Apr 01 2016 10:53pm
Location: San Diego, California

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by Ecyclist » Nov 29 2019 4:30pm

You can buy now on Amazon the 750W with controller for $99.00 shipping included.
I know, I know it's a Chinese junk, but so is everything else.
https://www.amazon.com/Electric-Brushle ... 3929992078
Don't expect from life to be easy and then it will be.
My builds:
Avian with hypocycloidal drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 2#p1318056
2016 GNG extreme drive https://endless-sphere.com/forums/viewt ... 28&t=82252

User avatar
amberwolf   100 GW

100 GW
Posts: 30388
Joined: Aug 17 2009 6:43am
Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA, Earth, Sol, Local Bubble, Orion Arm, Milky Way, Local Group
Contact:

Re: Small and big block rickshaw motors on Amazon.

Post by amberwolf » Nov 29 2019 11:03pm

Here's another version:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07WVTHS8F?ps ... WENARF4DTJ
This one says it's 600RPM output from the built-in gearbox. Don't know if the ratio in it's specs is that of it's gearbox, or the recommended ratio for it's output sprocket to the input sprocket of the system it's driving? Has no torque output rating listing.
Voltage: 48V DC
Output: 750W
Rated Current: 20A
Rated Speed: 600RPM
Gear Ratio: 6:1

The one linked in the rpevious posts says it's around 2800RPM (3100 unloaded), no gearbox (if there is one, it doesn't say that explicitly, and it's high rpm implies that the "gear ratio" given below is a recommended one for it's output sprocket ot a system input sprocket?).
Rated voltage: 48V DC
Output: 750W
Rated current: 15A
No load current: ≤3.0A
Rated speed: 2800RPM
No load speed: 3100RPM
Gear ratio: 5.6 : 1
Drive sprocket: 420-14T
Rated torque: 2.56 N.m


Looks like these use 14T 420 chain output sprockets, so plenty of relatively cheap chain and sprocket options for the other end of things.

I wonder if one of these might be able to run the SB Cruiser trike, thru a 3-speed IGH, for up to 20MPH? (which takes around 900-1000w to maintain, depending on wind/etc.)

And if so, I wonder if any of them would be able to provide enough torque (without destroying the IGH, presently an old Sachs Torpedo 3speed) to get the trike quickly started up from a stop.

Presently it takes around 4kW battery power into two big heavy 450x MXUS hubmotors in 20" (22"-ish actual) wheels to get the heavy trike from 0-20MPH in under 5 seconds.


I poked around at the simulator here
https://www.ebikes.ca/tools/simulator.h ... 7&axis=mph
which shows at startup I am probably getting around 125Lbs of thrust*. At 20MPH it's about 10Lbs, once throttled down to just maintain speed.

Assuming Lbs thrust is the same as Lb-ft, then that's 169.5Nm, and 13.6Nm.

The non-geared motor above says it's 2.56Nm output. If I use a sprocket ratio from 14to get around 100RPM max on the input of the IGH, from the ~2800RPM motor speed, that's 28:1 reduction? So 28 x 2.56 is 71.68Nm. That's only a bit less than half the startup torque needed to match my present acceleration rate, right?

I could change the gearing on the output of the IGH (or input at the wheel) for more torque, but I wouldn't get enough speed that way. (there isn't room for a shiftable drivetrain like a derailer at the wheel, and it probably wouldn't survive very long if I did have one).

However...if the motor itself doesn't have a gearbox, and it's shaft and gear can handle the torque, I can probably put bursts of 1500w thru it which may well make enough torque output to come close to what I already get?

I expect the IGH itself is probably not going to survive this long, either...I'd probably have to put two in parallel. Most likley it's better to use a bigger motor capable of more torque at the higher speed, and put it in the drivetrain past the IGH.

But...these things are a bit appealing in that there's a lot less DIY than using some other motor (hubmotor outside a wheel, powerchair motor, etc etc).

* the simulator appears to have a bug? It will not allow choosing anything ohter than Lbs thrust when using the Add mode and two motors. Not sure if convert Lbs thrust to Newton-meters same as Lb-ft (which is Lb-ft x 1.3558? )

Post Reply