My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

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Tjeska   10 W

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by Tjeska » Jan 22 2020 11:27am

So today, finally I got a message that my matt black Frey AM1000 high end would be delivered.

After ordering it on 2019-08-14, I was getting a little nervous about the whole "lets order a full bike from China" thing.
So after some delay's from Frey (a month), because i wanted a EX-1 drivetrain & Lyric fork, and the whole holiday season delay's I would finally ride my new bike today :D

Well at least not today, got big Frey box delivered with a Blue AM1000 with luggage rack inside :(
Something went probably wrong when the bikes entered Europe true Poland, cause thats when the UPS shipping label was created.

Who ordered a Blue Frey AM1000 with a luggage rack in Europe? :lol:
I just peeked in the box, it was my wife that opened the box and took a pic, to ask me "I tought you ordered a matt black one?"
Disappointed, when i was driving home from work earlier after getting the message that it arrived.

So hopefully I will get my bike soon, Grace already knows about the whole situation and I trust them to handle it like they should.

To be continued...

/Edit: This is not a "shame" post, just a heads up in case a forum member would receive my bike so we could sort it out.

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by Tessleaar » Jan 22 2020 6:49pm

Tjeska wrote:
Jan 22 2020 11:27am
So today, finally I got a message that my matt black Frey AM1000 high end would be delivered.

After ordering it on 2019-08-14, I was getting a little nervous about the whole "lets order a full bike from China" thing.
So after some delay's from Frey (a month), because i wanted a EX-1 drivetrain & Lyric fork, and the whole holiday season delay's I would finally ride my new bike today :D

Well at least not today, got big Frey box delivered with a Blue AM1000 with luggage rack inside :(
Something went probably wrong when the bikes entered Europe true Poland, cause thats when the UPS shipping label was created.

Who ordered a Blue Frey AM1000 with a luggage rack in Europe? :lol:
I just peeked in the box, it was my wife that opened the box and took a pic, to ask me "I tought you ordered a matt black one?"
Disappointed, when i was driving home from work earlier after getting the message that it arrived.

So hopefully I will get my bike soon, Grace already knows about the whole situation and I trust them to handle it like they should.

To be continued...

/Edit: This is not a "shame" post, just a heads up in case a forum member would receive my bike so we could sort it out.
He Tjeska,

I think I got your bike delivered, I ordered a Blue XL size one and I got a black one !
I send Grace a mail that something is gone wrong with the shipping

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by Tessleaar » Jan 22 2020 7:24pm

Tjeska,

Grace wil give you my phone number we can arrange something .
I live in Holland and work not far from the Belgian border. Contact me .

Tjeska   10 W

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by Tjeska » Jan 22 2020 11:52pm

Hi, I did send you a Pm and a WhatsApp message. 8)

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by Sinbord1981 » Jan 23 2020 3:21pm

Mine turned up today and I’m really pleased with the one I’ve built up so far.

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by Pauldugie » Jan 24 2020 12:20am

I just ordered my first e-bike, an AM1000 on January 15th. I ordered mine in matte black without decals, but after seeing Simon’s unboxing of a glossy black one with yellow lettering, I’m very envious.
I learned about Frey when I watched Micah Toll’s review of the Frey CC model on Electrek in my Flipboard app. When I visited the Frey website I found the AM1000. an internet search of the AM1000 led me to this forum. This thread is over 2 years old and I’ve learned so much about these bikes from your comments that I hope the thread continues as a resource for the foreseeable future.

I know Frey monitors this site and takes your concerns seriously. It’s comforting to know that reasonable complaints are handled appropriately and questions are answered promptly. It’s definitely a risk ordering my bike from a company, that to my knowledge, has no presence in the United States, but I’m confident that I’m buying a really good bike at a very reasonable price and that problems will be resolved fairly.

I’m getting the programming cable and control configuration software. I’m amazed that we have the ability to change so many variables. Has anyone found what they consider optimal settings?

I ordered lights, rear rack, and fenders for touring and a post dropper for aggressive downhill riding. I’m buying a better bike than I need, but even with every option, I’m paying far less than I would for a class 1 bike from Trek or Specialized although the shipping costs do cut into the savings.

My bike won’t be assembled until after the Spring Festival and I’m not expecting it to arrive here in upstate New York until the middle of March at the earliest. In the meantime please continue to post your thoughts on this bike. I really appreciate the expertise that is shared here and hope to share my own views when the bike finally arrives.

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by formula101 » Jan 24 2020 1:00am

In defense of more mainstream, or established bicycle companies, there are certain design advantages which for whatever reason, companies like frey have been slow to adopt. This includes steeper seat angles. Full suspension bikes sag into their travel, so a steeper seat angle is imperative compared to a hardtail. The bicycle industry is moving towards 77* sta's now. Also, hta's are getting slacker each year, offering more stability at higher speeds, with 65* considered to be 'average' and slacker still for enduro and dh bikes. Third, chainstay lengths are settling in around 43 to 45 cm for full suspension bikes, whereas frey goes with 48 cm chainstays.

Does any of this matter? In particular, will the bikes ride any worse for lack of the latest in frame geometry? All I know is that frey bike owners seem to love their bikes and they can be ridden as aggressively as any other brand.

The question is, would frey bikes be even better still if they adopted the latest geometry?

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by guel135 » Jan 24 2020 9:53am

after being in the riding part of the industry for many years. And there is a moment that you are not willing to have the last of the last every year. And if you look what they develop and what the wanted to sell in the past years many of these times it is only putting new things on the market to generate a need of buying a new product.
Look to the model wheel size 26 then 29, then 27,5 , then 27.5 plus and now again 29... But next year will probably be 29.72 inches the trend to go and you cannot go in the trail you love with your old only 29 bike.

And I am not in not buying new things style. For example, now I think will buy my road bike with disc and electronic shifting because I feel could be different from my old super racing carbon fiber already 11 years old 7kg road bike (specialized tarmac pro) than it is not stiff like the new ones. But it is so comfortable like the new endurance bikes.

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by mewanderinghome » Jan 28 2020 8:21pm

cscscs wrote:
Oct 17 2019 9:04pm
Personally I prefer the 17.5AH battery as the bike is already heavy and the range on the 17.5 is already plenty - also the 21 will protrude - I even removed the handle from mine as it was irritating my knee as it also protrudes).
I read this whole thread, and remember someone else also commenting that the 52v and 48v21ah batteries protrude further from the frame than the 48v17.4ah battery. However, Grace is telling me the battery cases are all the same. Can someone confirm this? I was planning on getting the 48v17.4ah battery because it doesn't protrude, should weigh less, should have enough capacity for me, and saves $130. But if they all protrude on the left, then I might pay the $130 extra for the 52v. I would also be very interested to learn how much the different batteries weigh if someone with each of the 3 battery sizes can "weigh in" on this?

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by mewanderinghome » Jan 29 2020 3:56am

Next Question TL;DR: Which display to get? Eggrider, Cycle Analyst, or Bafang C240, 500c, or SW102?

I don't like the large vertical display that ships with the AM1000 (which seems likely to be damaged if I endo the bike...which I freely admit has happened more than once before), so I'm looking at other options.

I like the Eggrider (https://eggbikes.com/eggrider) due to its small form factor and integrated controls mounting next to the left grip. I don't think I'll ever need it's dual-mode functionality (limiting speed on road, if you're concerned about being pulled over by police). I guess it's also a tiny plus that it can be paired to a mobile app if I wanted to use my phone as a larger display, but I don't foresee riding with my phone on the bars for the same crash reasons. It doesn't seem like pairing it to your phone does anything additional, like allow you to answer calls (a small speakerphone would be awesome, or even just some indication that your phone has received a text or call), nor even navigate which the Bafang 750c does (but I can't see ever needing navigation). I don't love that the Eggrider also has a vertical orientation that protrudes from the top/front of the bar and is therefore still prone to damage in a crash, but it is considerably smaller than the stock Bafang, and with it closer to the end of the bars, it's protected a bit by brake levers in front. And I could install bar ends angled up a bit to provide some protection if the bike flips over (bar ends angled up also being useful to act as a stand when flipping the bike over for service).

The Cycle Analyst (https://www.ebikes.ca/product-info/cycle-analyst-3.html) seems considerably larger than the Eggrider and like the Bafang requires separate buttons near the grip for power assist, but it appears slightly smaller than the stock Bafang and is at least horizontal, not protruding from the front of the bike. Perhaps it could be mounted directly behind the bar, protecting it well? It also seems to offer the most available data and control of the displays I'm considering. I'm by no means an expert in e-bikes, so a couple questions with this one:
1) Would it be relatively easy (or even possible) to use the CA with the AM1000? It appears I'd have to reroute the torque, cadence, and speed sensors from the motor controller to the CA display, and I'd like to add a temperature sensor so the CA can reduce power to the motor when it senses too much heat. Not sure how easy this would be to do..?
2) If I'm understanding it correctly, the CA would then basically override most of the settings of the Bafang controller, sending only essentially a throttle input to the Bafang controller..? For those of you with programming experience with the Bafang controller, do you see enough advantages in the seemingly infinitely-variable CA over the Bafang controller, to choose the CA if I want an alternate display? Or do you think the CA's capabilities aren't that necessary considering the programming capabilities of the Bafang? Or maybe you even think the Bafang programming would be superior?

The final idea is to get a smaller Bafang display that's compatible with the Ultra motor. I think my favorite would be the C240 (https://www.bafang-e.com/oem-area/compo ... p-c240can/) that Frey ships with their M600 bike. Frey says it's not compatible with the Ultra, but goes on to add that each motor comes with an associated display...making me wonder if it might actually work with the Ultra but they can't/don't want to separate a C240 from the M600 motor. I can't find the C240 for sale separately anywhere anyway. But if anyone here knows if it could be made compatible and if so where I could get it, please let me know. I love that this C240 mounts behind the bar, just to the right of the stem, so it is well protected and discreet. I rode an e-bike with I believe a Shimano steps motor, and it had a similar display location & size and was awesome. This would probably be my leading candidate if it works and I can get it.

Apparently the Bafang 500c is compatible (https://electricbike-blog.com/2018/11/3 ... -displays/), which is smaller than the CA, larger than the Eggrider but also has integrated controls, and this one is horizontal. This has haptic feedback which I think would be a nice little plus. Would probably still need bar ends to help protect it, and this display being larger I'm not sure they would protect it as well.

Bafang also has a SW102 display (https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B07 ... 362GS&th=1) which is basically the same form factor as the Eggrider for half the cost, but I haven't been able to find out if it would work with the Ultra. Anyone know?

What are your thoughts?

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by barbarossa » Jan 29 2020 12:42pm

mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 28 2020 8:21pm
cscscs wrote:
Oct 17 2019 9:04pm
Personally I prefer the 17.5AH battery as the bike is already heavy and the range on the 17.5 is already plenty - also the 21 will protrude - I even removed the handle from mine as it was irritating my knee as it also protrudes).
I read this whole thread, and remember someone else also commenting that the 52v and 48v21ah batteries protrude further from the frame than the 48v17.4ah battery. However, Grace is telling me the battery cases are all the same. Can someone confirm this? I was planning on getting the 48v17.4ah battery because it doesn't protrude, should weigh less, should have enough capacity for me, and saves $130. But if they all protrude on the left, then I might pay the $130 extra for the 52v. I would also be very interested to learn how much the different batteries weigh if someone with each of the 3 battery sizes can "weigh in" on this?
I was always thinking that the battery case of Frey am1000 should always be a Reention Dorado Max 505mm with max 80 cells. there are 2 Dorado Max versions but the smaller version will not physically match i think.
-later edited/added: there is also a 505mm Dorado Plus version that might also match the Frey original mount, have a look at my later post…-

anyways 48v, 21ah = 13s6p = 78 cells and 17.5ah = 13s5p = 65 cells. 52v = 14s5p = 70 cells. One cell is about 46 gramms. so you can do the math.

build of the original battery (i have the 48v 13s6p) is ok, charger is also ok.
but of course all the current of the 48v battery is going through 2 nickel strips only (i took that picture from a post before):
current.JPG
current.JPG (63.62 KiB) Viewed 1211 times
but if you wanna have something better, regarding higher current and less voltage drop i recommend building your own 15s or 14s battery with a good smart bms for example Speedict Neptune 15 (the original bms for my 13s battery was 14s BMS with one shorted balance wire - that procedure is normal) or perhaps you know someone who builds packs. perhaps you can order it with an empty battery case.
strange that a benefit of the 48v battery should be the 13s bms which is in fact a 14s bms which is even prepared for 15s counting the solder points :) (was posted some posts before)
IMG_4690.jpg
IMG_4690.jpg (83.01 KiB) Viewed 1191 times
first i have built a 15s5p with 75x LG HG2 cells. nice setup and low voltage drop with copper/nickel strip sandwich as serial connections. i only charge up to 61.5v for more cycles - but i have changed the caps to 80v so i could also charge to 63v.
at 60amps you have really fun…
speedict3.jpg
speedict3.jpg (72.18 KiB) Viewed 1211 times
now i build a 19s4p battery with Sony VTC6 cells… original Bafang Ultra FETs should be 85v/120a with around 6-8 mOhm RDS(on) - only the low voltage section is a problem (needs an TVS Diode, no error above 63v from controller but i think that the eggrider display might become a problem - although it works above 63v) and the 63v caps have to be changed to 80v or 100v.
thats how the naked pack looks like, there are 5 modules with room for 16 cells each:
IMG_4624.jpg
IMG_4624.jpg (72.15 KiB) Viewed 1211 times
Last edited by barbarossa on Jan 31 2020 1:49am, edited 5 times in total.

Tjeska   10 W

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by Tjeska » Jan 29 2020 2:49pm

mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 29 2020 3:56am
Next Question TL;DR: Which display to get? Eggrider, Cycle Analyst, or Bafang C240, 500c, or SW102?

I don't like the large vertical display that ships with the AM1000 (which seems likely to be damaged if I endo the bike...which I freely admit has happened more than once before), so I'm looking at other options.

What are your thoughts?
I also don't like the large display, to much on the handlebar that way.

Bought a 500C and really like it, small, color, intuitive to use, and looks much much better.

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by amberwolf » Jan 29 2020 8:23pm

mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 29 2020 3:56am
Next Question TL;DR: Which display to get? Eggrider, Cycle Analyst, or Bafang C240, 500c, or SW102?
it appears you may already realize this, but the cycle analyst is not a display for your controller. it is a separate ev computer that (depending on version and how you wire the whole system with it) can do a lot of things, but it cannot talk to your controller, nor display any information from it. so as you note, if used to it's maximum ability, you'd wire everything thru it so it can send throttle to the ocntroller, and then you would set the controller up for it's maximum possible response to throttle, max power, etc., so the ca can instead do all the limiting.

note that the ca has one limitation that for me is severe: it cannot respond to any torque sensor readings until the cranks are moving at 50rpm or more. so if you need the torque response to get started (like i do) from a stop, you'd need something else that does. if the existing controller can already do this, then you should stick with that if you need it. (you *can* build simple electronics external to the ca that fool it into thinking the pedals are already moving fast enough, if you want/need other features of the ca, some of which are quite useful in some systems / situations).


if you are looking for something to be able to change your controller's settings, you must get one that is specifically compatible with your controller. i don't know which one that is. if you don't, it may not be able to display some or any of the info the controller sends it, and it may not be able to send any settings to the controller.

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by cscscs » Jan 30 2020 1:13am

mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 28 2020 8:21pm
I read this whole thread, and remember someone else also commenting that the 52v and 48v21ah batteries protrude further from the frame than the 48v17.4ah battery. However, Grace is telling me the battery cases are all the same. Can someone confirm this? I was planning on getting the 48v17.4ah battery because it doesn't protrude, should weigh less, should have enough capacity for me, and saves $130. But if they all protrude on the left, then I might pay the $130 extra for the 52v. I would also be very interested to learn how much the different batteries weigh if someone with each of the 3 battery sizes can "weigh in" on this?
Maybe the 52v case has been redesigned to be taller instead of wider??? But if you look closely in the unboxing video just a few posts ago you can see the extra width of the battery extending outboard of the frame on the left side.

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by cscscs » Jan 30 2020 2:00am

mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 29 2020 3:56am
Next Question TL;DR: Which display to get? Eggrider, Cycle Analyst, or Bafang C240, 500c, or SW102?

What are your thoughts?
I swapped out the stock display (DP C18.UART) for the 500C and like it much better. I found the C18 display obscenely large and vulnerable and the assist buttons were too sensitive and too close together (or otherwise indistinguishable) so I often increased assist when I meant to decrease and vise versa or simply changed assist unintentionally. The 500C is much better in that regard but the buttons are still somewhat indistinguishable (meaning that when focused on the trail, I can't instantly find the correct button). I ended up gluing a small half round rubber button onto the upper button which makes a nice index for my thumb and fixed that issue. I would prefer a form factor like the C240 where the assist selector takes up minimal width real estate on the bar (to make more room for the dropper lever and throttle) and also like the minimalist display that mounts downwind of the bar instead of on top. That said, I don't think the C240 is compatible as it is different comm protocol than the DP C18 (CAN vs UART), but I have made an inquiry with someone who can find out for sure and should know in a couple of days - if it is compatible I would definitely be interested.

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by cvin » Jan 30 2020 2:13am

Good info
Thank you

I like the big displays , just want mine to have 9 levels of pas...

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by mewanderinghome » Jan 30 2020 12:23pm

cscscs wrote:
Jan 30 2020 1:13am
Maybe the 52v case has been redesigned to be taller instead of wider??? But if you look closely in the unboxing video just a few posts ago you can see the extra width of the battery extending outboard of the frame on the left side.
If my understanding is correct, I think Grace is saying all the batteries stick out on the left, even the lighter, $130-saving 17.4ah, because all the batteries use the same case. Do you have the 17.4 battery, and if so you're saying it doesn't protrude? If so I would definitely go with the 17.4 for smaller form factor as well, but it sounds like barbarossa is also confirming it's likely the same case for all 3 batteries (and apparently he does have the 17.4). If they're the same width case, and it sounds like only 230g difference (thanks barbarossa), then I'll probably pay the extra to go with the 52v...or maybe get crazy and try building my own :shock: (<-- that's me when I cross some leads I shouldn't ; )

Also cscscs, does sound like the C240 won't work, but please let me know when you hear for sure. Otherwise I think I'll start with the 500c display. Thanks :)

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by mewanderinghome » Jan 30 2020 12:59pm

amberwolf wrote:
Jan 29 2020 8:23pm
note that the ca has one limitation that for me is severe: it cannot respond to any torque sensor readings until the cranks are moving at 50rpm or more
Yeah it seemed to me that this latest CA can act as a primary display (with temperature power roll-off & a lot of other customizability), if I went to the work of re-routing cabling. If I understand correctly, it seems the CA would be installed inline with the throttle cable, and the brake cutoff cables (one of which I'll probably nix anyway) would then terminate at the CA, not having to go into the downtube. But I'd have to extend the torque and cadence cables (are these one integrated cable?) up to the CA (along with a temp sensor cable). So I'm hoping there's room for another cable in the downtube access hole. I also ordered a gear change sensor that I may or may not use, but I don't know the location of that on the bike (guessing it's some sort of tension sensor inline with shift cable somewhere?), so not sure if that's a cable I'd have to shorten or lengthen.

I thought I saw a CA video that showed how to adjust the torque level at which the CA starts sending go-juice, but you're saying 50 rpm is the minimum? If so I totally agree with you--I want assist from start as long as I'm really bearing down on the pedal and not just resting my foot there. If that's the case, I will likely just get the 500c display to start since it's half the price of the Eggrider, still quite a bit smaller than the stock display, and I don't think I'd have much use for some of the Eggrider features. Only thing I don't like about the 500c is that it has 9 levels of PAS- I'm the opposite in that I just want 5 (less 'shifting' : ) Does anyone know if there's a way to reduce it to fewer levels of assist in the settings?

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by barbarossa » Jan 30 2020 3:16pm

mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 30 2020 12:59pm
and I don't think I'd have much use for some of the Eggrider features
one feature of eggrider v2 i really appreciate is to change/adapt the Bafang controller settings during my rides - ALL Bafang Ultra settings can be changed incl. torque settings (dont forget to power off/on after setting was changed). you need no programming cable or computer anymore. in the end you can adapt your controller settings perfect regarding your personal needs because you dont have longer breaks to connect a computer. also number of PAS levels can be adapted. it also has no silly voltage restriction. you can even set the multiplier of amperage - i need it because of the shunt modded controller - so it even shows the correct wattage/amperage. you can set up to 3 batteries with different max and min voltages and ampere hours - so your percentage is exact. a perfect little display (in combination with a smartphone absolutely perfect) - none of the other mentioned displays will combine all this features for your Bafang Ultra - but of course it is more expensive...

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Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by amberwolf » Jan 30 2020 5:09pm

mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 30 2020 12:59pm
Yeah it seemed to me that this latest CA can act as a primary display (with temperature power roll-off & a lot of other customizability), if I went to the work of re-routing cabling. If I understand correctly, it seems the CA would be installed inline with the throttle cable, and the brake cutoff cables (one of which I'll probably nix anyway) would then terminate at the CA, not having to go into the downtube. But I'd have to extend the torque and cadence cables (are these one integrated cable?) up to the CA (along with a temp sensor cable).
basically, yes.

you'd also need to figure out how to wire that torque sensor and cadence sensor to the pas connector of the ca v3, including what voltage they require (the torque sensor is probably more than 5v, the cadence is probably 5v), so you can ensure it gets what it needs. the pas ca v3 connector provides 5v and 10v, anything else you'd have to come up with separately.

configuring the sensors in the ca is done per the pas menus, once it's attached and working, and is easy enough but may take iterative experimentation to get it responding the way you want.
I also ordered a gear change sensor that I may or may not use, but I don't know the location of that on the bike (guessing it's some sort of tension sensor inline with shift cable somewhere?), so not sure if that's a cable I'd have to shorten or lengthen.
the gearsensor is basically like the hwbs hidden-wire-brake-sensor, where whenever the gearsensor detects cable movment it gives a pulse to temporarily turn off the motor. (the hwbs stays off once cable moves past a certain point, because it isn't springloaded inside like the gs likely is).

if it's output grounds momentarily then you can just wire it in parallle with the ca's ebrake input. then whenever you shift the ca will momentarily stop providing throttle to the motor...but you would have to have maximum ramping 99.99v/s for throttle off in the ca to ensure it turns throttle off fast enough for it to make any difference to shifting.




I thought I saw a CA video that showed how to adjust the torque level at which the CA starts sending go-juice, but you're saying 50 rpm is the minimum?
i was pretty sure that's the limit, but i can't find a specific post or page in the manual stating this in this way. there are statements that 50rpm is the minimum pas assist start, which is probably why the torque won't start below that either. :? if you have a high-pole-count cadence sensor (i think 24 is the max for the ca?) then it doesn't take much of a rotation to give a 50rpm count into the ca...but it does take some amount of crank rotation before it will start from either torque or cadence sensor.

on a regular bike of regular weight with regular rider you will probably not have any problems because of it...but you'd have to experiment to see if this is sufficient for you.

according to justin_le here they've been trying to change so the torque sensor works by itself, but hadn't done it yet, that was a couple years ago, and the latest firmare (3.13?) i tried it in was no different for me:
viewtopic.php?f=4&t=37964&p=1362554

i haven't even tried to do it in a while; i'm presently not even using the torque at all (tdcm bb) just cadence off that bb sensor, which works reasonably well if not perfectly, once i'm moving (a cadence sensor with more poles would work better, and possibly one that is not on the cranks but instead is on the gearing stages after that might work better, i have an experiment planned to test this, eventually). but i have to startup with the throttle, most of the time. (if i'm on level ground or a very slight downslope i can start pedaling and it will start moving and provide a very minimum assist, enough to keep moving at that speed, barely, but it won't accelerate and allow me to be able to pedal fast enough to get it going any faster, and i have to use a throttle blip to get going. if i'm on a little better downslope, still extremely slight, it'll get going normally. if i'm upslope at all, i can't start it up without the throttle.)



afaik the original idea behind the minimum was that this would help prevent a bike from just taking off under you when you stand on the pedals at a stop to ready for startup, or when mounting a bike, etc. but having it as a hard-coded limit makes it problematic for a number of usage scenarios, which while rare are not unheard of. :( on regular bikes with regular riders under regular conditions none of this matters much, but it does matter for some, and for unusual cases like mine.

the only workaround i know of (other than just using the throttle to get going) at present is to have a "startup" button or switch somewhere that either provides a fake cadence signal to the ca so torque works as if you were already going, or provides a throttle signal of sufficient voltage to get you going, wehther or not you actually ahve a throttle on the system (temporarily bypassing the ca's actual throttle output, or providing a signal to the ca's throttle in connector, whichever is required based on your other ca settings).

If so I totally agree with you--I want assist from start as long as I'm really bearing down on the pedal and not just resting my foot there.


in the ca, you can "zero" the torque sensor at whatever level you want, so you can either zero it without feet on there, or zero it with them, but this would only be really useful if it would initially respond to torque without rotation.

cscscs   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 32
Joined: Jun 28 2019 2:23pm

Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by cscscs » Jan 31 2020 12:46am

mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 30 2020 12:23pm
cscscs wrote:
Jan 30 2020 1:13am
Maybe the 52v case has been redesigned to be taller instead of wider??? But if you look closely in the unboxing video just a few posts ago you can see the extra width of the battery extending outboard of the frame on the left side.
If my understanding is correct, I think Grace is saying all the batteries stick out on the left, even the lighter, $130-saving 17.4ah, because all the batteries use the same case. Do you have the 17.4 battery, and if so you're saying it doesn't protrude? If so I would definitely go with the 17.4 for smaller form factor as well, but it sounds like barbarossa is also confirming it's likely the same case for all 3 batteries (and apparently he does have the 17.4). If they're the same width case, and it sounds like only 230g difference (thanks barbarossa), then I'll probably pay the extra to go with the 52v...or maybe get crazy and try building my own :shock: (<-- that's me when I cross some leads I shouldn't ; )

Also cscscs, does sound like the C240 won't work, but please let me know when you hear for sure. Otherwise I think I'll start with the 500c display. Thanks :)
My 17.5 battery came off a FLX Blade so might be different from what Frey is providing.

barbarossa   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 43
Joined: Jul 21 2018 4:18pm

Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by barbarossa » Jan 31 2020 1:20am

cscscs wrote:
Jan 31 2020 12:46am
mewanderinghome wrote:
Jan 30 2020 12:23pm
cscscs wrote:
Jan 30 2020 1:13am
Maybe the 52v case has been redesigned to be taller instead of wider??? But if you look closely in the unboxing video just a few posts ago you can see the extra width of the battery extending outboard of the frame on the left side.
If my understanding is correct, I think Grace is saying all the batteries stick out on the left, even the lighter, $130-saving 17.4ah, because all the batteries use the same case. Do you have the 17.4 battery, and if so you're saying it doesn't protrude? If so I would definitely go with the 17.4 for smaller form factor as well, but it sounds like barbarossa is also confirming it's likely the same case for all 3 batteries (and apparently he does have the 17.4). If they're the same width case, and it sounds like only 230g difference (thanks barbarossa), then I'll probably pay the extra to go with the 52v...or maybe get crazy and try building my own :shock: (<-- that's me when I cross some leads I shouldn't ; )

Also cscscs, does sound like the C240 won't work, but please let me know when you hear for sure. Otherwise I think I'll start with the 500c display. Thanks :)
My 17.5 battery came off a FLX Blade so might be different from what Frey is providing.

perhaps everyone is right. the FLX blade uses a Reention Dorado Plus that is also available as a 505mm version with 65 cells max. -> 13s5p = 5x3.5Ah= 17.5Ah at 48v
dorado_plus.JPG
dorado_plus.JPG (65.45 KiB) Viewed 974 times
but Frey -i think- always uses a Reention Dorado Max (of course installing fewer cells in the bigger case for the 48v/17.5Ah version is never a problem):
dorado_max.JPG
dorado_max.JPG (68.1 KiB) Viewed 974 times
anyways the Dorado Plus version looks like a smart alternative for the bigger Dorado Max battery case. which brings me to a new idea for my next battery built :lol:
@cscscs: you simply took your Dorado Plus FLX battery and it matched with the Frey frame original mounts !?

cscscs   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 32
Joined: Jun 28 2019 2:23pm

Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by cscscs » Jan 31 2020 2:03am

barbarossa wrote:
Jan 31 2020 1:20am
@cscscs: you simply took your Dorado Plus FLX battery and it matched with the Frey frame original mounts !?
I swapped everything over to a bare AM1000 frame, but I suspect the end caps are the same regardless.

barbarossa   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 43
Joined: Jul 21 2018 4:18pm

Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by barbarossa » Jan 31 2020 2:51am

cscscs wrote:
Jan 31 2020 2:03am
barbarossa wrote:
Jan 31 2020 1:20am
@cscscs: you simply took your Dorado Plus FLX battery and it matched with the Frey frame original mounts !?
I swapped everything over to a bare AM1000 frame, but I suspect the end caps are the same regardless.
aahhh… i remember you bought a naked Frey frame. and now i understand : you reused the original Dorado Plus plastic mounts and your FLX Dorado Plus battery and it all matched in your empty Frey frame. a very useful information !!! thank you. i think a new project is born for me. i plan to test Samsung 40T INR21700 35A cells. Dorado Plus case is smaller which is nice and would probably be good for 57x 21700 cells (19s3p) which will provide not much range but a good punch for smaller ranges.
buying a new Reention battery case all mounts are included anyways so this would be no problem too. and this Reention cases are cheap :lol:
interesting… thank you for your input :D

18650   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 23
Joined: Feb 26 2018 3:00pm

Re: My Bafang Ultra Mountain Bike! Frey AM1000

Post by 18650 » Jan 31 2020 4:28am

Did anybody buy the Frey EX? Could you share your experience? (is there a separate thread for that, I couldn't find one?)

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