Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 19 2020 8:59pm

Looks good with that 3x18 SR241 on the rear, yah, I don't think you will run out of traction

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by X-Nitro » Apr 20 2020 1:31am

Looks good. Let's see..now I want to run a kenda k270 2.75x21 with the sr244, for my black rims; Would like to try it on the rear also but I gotta kill the 244 first.
And
I'll match my front 241 with that 3.00x18 on a set of silver rims, retro. :D
:shock: 48v 1500w Custom 1/2 fatty bannaseat hardtail hub streetbike - The modern electric "stingray" mullet bike :bolt: E-Goat Sur-Ron

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by pipeking » Apr 20 2020 6:24am

Hey guys, having problems with my sur ron was wondering if anyone else has had similar issues?

Its cutting out, first few times was from a standstill there was nothing, but now its cutting out at full gas and dying... an unplug battery seems to fix it for about 5km then it quits again.

I have an x controller that was upgrade from the original controller, I am thinking about swapping it back on to see if this goes away.

sucks balls cos its sooo good for stealthing round during this lockdown bs

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Merlin » Apr 20 2020 6:53am

if display shuts also down your bms trips. that would be pretty weird since your X doesnt squeeze much more out of the battery.

which year is your surron?
offroad model or L1e?

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Offroader   100 MW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Offroader » Apr 20 2020 11:32am

I would swap the battery first but that is probably not possible as you do nit have a spare. It does seem like a bms issue with the battery.

Swap the controller then to rule that out.

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 20 2020 12:08pm

X-Nitro wrote:
Apr 20 2020 1:31am
Looks good. Let's see..now I want to run a kenda k270 2.75x21 with the sr244, for my black rims; Would like to try it on the rear also but I gotta kill the 244 first.
And
I'll match my front 241 with that 3.00x18 on a set of silver rims, retro. :D
Are you going to lace a 21x1.60 rim up front?

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 20 2020 12:12pm

pipeking wrote:
Apr 20 2020 6:24am
Hey guys, having problems with my sur ron was wondering if anyone else has had similar issues?

Its cutting out, first few times was from a standstill there was nothing, but now its cutting out at full gas and dying... an unplug battery seems to fix it for about 5km then it quits again.

I have an x controller that was upgrade from the original controller, I am thinking about swapping it back on to see if this goes away.

sucks balls cos its sooo good for stealthing round during this lockdown bs
Had the same issue with mine, it would cut out, but the horn, lights, and display all worked, and it eventually quit working all together, even thought the lights, horn, and display were functioning properly. I eventually learned it was a fet in the controller and Luna sent me a new one. During the trouble shooting process, Luna asked me to disconnect the break safety wires and kickstand to rule out it wasn't something like that. Provided that your instruments are still working, have you disconnected the safety wires?

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 20 2020 3:13pm

Can anyone recommend a suspension specialist I can send my Marzocchi forks too for a complete rebuild and revalve? I used Hippie Tech located in Garden City Idaho in the past, but Jerry has closed up shop.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Allex » Apr 20 2020 4:27pm

Offroader wrote:
Apr 19 2020 5:26pm
Nice, yes the high rise bars was probably the best first upgrade you can do on this bike.

For me I think I would go with the x-chain because I don't like to be bothered lubing the chain, I will deal with more friction than bother spraying down the chain with oil.

Rix, I missed it where you decided to go back to the sur-ron. The last thing I remember is you sold your sur-ron to go with that larger electric dirt bike. I see you are back to a sur-ron again.
Stock o-ring chain is horrible, I bet you lose 250Watt in that damn chain because of o-rings.
belt drive makes it a totally different bike for those who ride in dry conditions and 48T at the rear makes it boring compared to 52/55. Som much more life in the bike with those extra teeth.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by macribs » Apr 20 2020 4:45pm

Offroader wrote:
Apr 19 2020 6:01pm
Did another ride with my new tire and I'm really like thing Shinko 241 tire. I lowered the PSI to around 10 and really rode the bike hard today.

Best part is now I can ride on the street without constantly thinking about how its wearing out my tires. I think one small drawback is that with the lower PSI it seems like the bike may lose a little bit of top speed?


Looks good. Two things that might affect the top speed now. First off, that Shinko likely has more rolling resistance then the stock tire. Then that will most likely add up as you keep dropping tire pressure. Put on a tubliss and lower to 3-5 psi and you will like loose even more top speed but will have fantastic grip offroad. And so easy and quick repair should you ever have a flat.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by macribs » Apr 20 2020 4:49pm

Rix wrote:
Apr 19 2020 5:21pm
Got the 64T on and tested, still hit 38-39MPH, almost as fast as my old SurRon with the 55T sprocket which was a solid 39mph on the radar trailer. Thank you field weakening. And this will loop my ass over backwards if hit the throttle from start. Also got my high rise bars on. This was a huge difference, it makes the whole bike feel just a bit bigger.

Image


That 64T looks like a perfect match. Have you gotten a chance to try it in the rough and up still climbs? You on stock controller btw?

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Offroader » Apr 20 2020 5:11pm

Rix wrote:
Apr 20 2020 3:13pm
Can anyone recommend a suspension specialist I can send my Marzocchi forks too for a complete rebuild and revalve? I used Hippie Tech located in Garden City Idaho in the past, but Jerry has closed up shop.
I would consider avalanche suspension, they have a rebuild for that specific fork. I just spoke with them recently and he knows about the sur-ron and has many people contact him about it. He also knows how to deal with the heavier sur-ron and weight distribution. This is also good that he likes the ebikes, because you may get places that hate ebikes and don't want anything to do with them.

I may get my shock and fork rebuilt by them also. It seems they are one of the best in the downhill community, usually recommended as the best place to get stuff rebuilt in the downhill forums.

http://www.avalanchedownhillracing.com/

Specific upgrade for the Marzocchi 888
http://www.avalanchedownhillracing.com/ ... 202008.htm
Last edited by Offroader on Apr 20 2020 5:29pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Offroader » Apr 20 2020 5:27pm

macribs wrote:
Apr 20 2020 4:45pm


Looks good. Two things that might affect the top speed now. First off, that Shinko likely has more rolling resistance then the stock tire. Then that will most likely add up as you keep dropping tire pressure. Put on a tubliss and lower to 3-5 psi and you will like loose even more top speed but will have fantastic grip offroad. And so easy and quick repair should you ever have a flat.
Yes, it is probably both of those things. It isn't too bad though and I don't realize it anymore. It is surprising how quickly you get used to what you are riding. That is why everytime I increased my bike power, a week later I was checking to see if my bike was actually putting out the extra watts.

I think 10 PSI is low enough because I don't want to deal with even more rolling resistance. I was actually thinking about that, why would I want to go to tubless when already 10PSI is very soft. You would have to be doing some really hard core off-roading and no street riding to want to go that low.

Thats why 3.5 or 4.0" may be really pushing it on the sur-ron because you probably get even more rolling resistance, especially when running lower psi.

3.00" and 10psi may be the sweet spot for the rear time for a dual sport riding style where you ride street and off-road. The 3.00" tire also allows you to run the low PSI, not sure if you would want to run such low psi on a 2.75" tire.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by pipeking » Apr 20 2020 5:36pm

Merlin wrote:
Apr 20 2020 6:53am
if display shuts also down your bms trips. that would be pretty weird since your X doesnt squeeze much more out of the battery.

which year is your surron?
offroad model or L1e?
No the display stays on. My bike is an earlier model, the one that didn't have the x controller stock, I got it in 2018
Rix wrote:
Apr 20 2020 12:12pm
Had the same issue with mine, it would cut out, but the horn, lights, and display all worked, and it eventually quit working all together, even thought the lights, horn, and display were functioning properly. I eventually learned it was a fet in the controller and Luna sent me a new one. During the trouble shooting process, Luna asked me to disconnect the break safety wires and kickstand to rule out it wasn't something like that. Provided that your instruments are still working, have you disconnected the safety wires?
Hi, yea that sounds very similar to whats going on with mine. The lights and horn have been removed but the display stays on. I am positive it can't be any safety switch, as I have removed every one of them, including the tilt sensor. They inhibit fast riding way too much, they all got disconnected in the first week I had it.

I emailed Adam from AE Bikes in Australia, where I got it from, still waiting to hear back from him... did I read somewhere he is actually a licensed motor dealer? 8)

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by X-Nitro » Apr 20 2020 6:24pm

Rix wrote:
Apr 20 2020 12:08pm
X-Nitro wrote:
Apr 20 2020 1:31am
Looks good. Let's see..now I want to run a kenda k270 2.75x21 with the sr244, for my black rims; Would like to try it on the rear also but I gotta kill the 244 first.
And
I'll match my front 241 with that 3.00x18 on a set of silver rims, retro. :D
Are you going to lace a 21x1.60 rim up front?
Yes 1.6" front 2.15" rear, single-butt spokes, cross-3, black nipps. 8)
:shock: 48v 1500w Custom 1/2 fatty bannaseat hardtail hub streetbike - The modern electric "stingray" mullet bike :bolt: E-Goat Sur-Ron

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 20 2020 9:22pm

X-Nitro wrote:
Apr 20 2020 6:24pm
Rix wrote:
Apr 20 2020 12:08pm
X-Nitro wrote:
Apr 20 2020 1:31am
Looks good. Let's see..now I want to run a kenda k270 2.75x21 with the sr244, for my black rims; Would like to try it on the rear also but I gotta kill the 244 first.
And
I'll match my front 241 with that 3.00x18 on a set of silver rims, retro. :D
Are you going to lace a 21x1.60 rim up front?
Yes 1.6" front 2.15" rear, single-butt spokes, cross-3, black nipps. 8)
Will be sweet, and feel like a big bike I bet. Look forward to seeing it.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 20 2020 9:23pm

Offroader wrote:
Apr 20 2020 5:11pm
Rix wrote:
Apr 20 2020 3:13pm
Can anyone recommend a suspension specialist I can send my Marzocchi forks too for a complete rebuild and revalve? I used Hippie Tech located in Garden City Idaho in the past, but Jerry has closed up shop.
I would consider avalanche suspension, they have a rebuild for that specific fork. I just spoke with them recently and he knows about the sur-ron and has many people contact him about it. He also knows how to deal with the heavier sur-ron and weight distribution. This is also good that he likes the ebikes, because you may get places that hate ebikes and don't want anything to do with them.

I may get my shock and fork rebuilt by them also. It seems they are one of the best in the downhill community, usually recommended as the best place to get stuff rebuilt in the downhill forums.

http://www.avalanchedownhillracing.com/

Specific upgrade for the Marzocchi 888
http://www.avalanchedownhillracing.com/ ... 202008.htm
I will check out Avalanche racing. Thank you.

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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 20 2020 9:33pm

pipeking wrote:
Apr 20 2020 5:36pm
Merlin wrote:
Apr 20 2020 6:53am
if display shuts also down your bms trips. that would be pretty weird since your X doesnt squeeze much more out of the battery.

which year is your surron?
offroad model or L1e?
No the display stays on. My bike is an earlier model, the one that didn't have the x controller stock, I got it in 2018
Rix wrote:
Apr 20 2020 12:12pm
Had the same issue with mine, it would cut out, but the horn, lights, and display all worked, and it eventually quit working all together, even thought the lights, horn, and display were functioning properly. I eventually learned it was a fet in the controller and Luna sent me a new one. During the trouble shooting process, Luna asked me to disconnect the break safety wires and kickstand to rule out it wasn't something like that. Provided that your instruments are still working, have you disconnected the safety wires?
Hi, yea that sounds very similar to whats going on with mine. The lights and horn have been removed but the display stays on. I am positive it can't be any safety switch, as I have removed every one of them, including the tilt sensor. They inhibit fast riding way too much, they all got disconnected in the first week I had it.

I emailed Adam from AE Bikes in Australia, where I got it from, still waiting to hear back from him... did I read somewhere he is actually a licensed motor dealer? 8)
Either he, or Rodney 64 of Luna Mate have gotten these bikes road legal in Australia. As far as trouble shooting your bike, should pull of the skid plate and pull off the controller, and check all plug in connections. Just to rule that out.
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Rix   100 GW

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 20 2020 9:36pm

macribs wrote:
Apr 20 2020 4:49pm
Rix wrote:
Apr 19 2020 5:21pm
Got the 64T on and tested, still hit 38-39MPH, almost as fast as my old SurRon with the 55T sprocket which was a solid 39mph on the radar trailer. Thank you field weakening. And this will loop my ass over backwards if hit the throttle from start. Also got my high rise bars on. This was a huge difference, it makes the whole bike feel just a bit bigger.

Image


That 64T looks like a perfect match. Have you gotten a chance to try it in the rough and up still climbs? You on stock controller btw?
Going to take it to "Carol Summit" this weekend and put it through the paces and see how it goes. I rode the green SurRon in this area before, but I didn't have the power to climb a couple of hills. With the X and 64T, I am betting I will.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by macribs » Apr 21 2020 2:05am

Rix wrote:
Apr 20 2020 9:36pm
macribs wrote:
Apr 20 2020 4:49pm
Rix wrote:
Apr 19 2020 5:21pm
Got the 64T on and tested, still hit 38-39MPH, almost as fast as my old SurRon with the 55T sprocket which was a solid 39mph on the radar trailer. Thank you field weakening. And this will loop my ass over backwards if hit the throttle from start. Also got my high rise bars on. This was a huge difference, it makes the whole bike feel just a bit bigger.

Image


That 64T looks like a perfect match. Have you gotten a chance to try it in the rough and up still climbs? You on stock controller btw?
Going to take it to "Carol Summit" this weekend and put it through the paces and see how it goes. I rode the green SurRon in this area before, but I didn't have the power to climb a couple of hills. With the X and 64T, I am betting I will.

I hope your knee is healing the right way and you are back to old self really soon. Nice to see you are back onto sur ron. That whole Alta situation and how it ended for Alta was sad really. Such a great product ending up on the shelf of can-am. Hopefully they will bring some cool EV's to the market based on the Alta.

Try to make a vid if you manage to climb stuff you previously didn't to try to put that 64T sprocket into context. Are you running the stock controller on the sur ron or have you upgraded?

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by JuiceMeUp » Apr 21 2020 3:32am

pipeking wrote:
Apr 20 2020 6:24am
Hey guys, having problems with my sur ron was wondering if anyone else has had similar issues?

Its cutting out, first few times was from a standstill there was nothing, but now its cutting out at full gas and dying... an unplug battery seems to fix it for about 5km then it quits again.

I have an x controller that was upgrade from the original controller, I am thinking about swapping it back on to see if this goes away.

sucks balls cos its sooo good for stealthing round during this lockdown bs
Cuts out for no good reason?
Key off. Key on. Goes OK for a bit then cuts power again. Rinse and repeat?
You've tried disconnecting all the safety cutouts to eliminate them (brake switches, kickstand sensor etc)?
Could also be failed Motor Hall sensor due to moisture ingress. It's a spare part and a bit of a prick to change but worth a look.
Pop the cover off the side of the motor and look for signs of corrosion.
Also unplug and check / clean all connectors.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by crazy_dave » Apr 21 2020 8:14am

pipeking wrote:
Apr 20 2020 6:24am
Hey guys, having problems with my sur ron was wondering if anyone else has had similar issues?

Its cutting out, first few times was from a standstill there was nothing, but now its cutting out at full gas and dying... an unplug battery seems to fix it for about 5km then it quits again.

I have an x controller that was upgrade from the original controller, I am thinking about swapping it back on to see if this goes away.

sucks balls cos its sooo good for stealthing round during this lockdown bs
If you have already eliminated the brake and kickstand switches........
Get rid of the (tip-over) sensor. I had the same problem after I in stalled my X-controller. I thought I got my sensor right but that damn thing must be touchy. Kept randomly cutting out, eliminated the (tip-over) and have not had a problem since. Its tight under the controller and hard to get everything back exactly right.

Damn, never-mind, just saw that you removed it already. Long shot but....... You said that you have an older model. Is the motor compatible with the X-controller.
It’s better to apologize than it is to ask permission.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by motomoto » Apr 21 2020 9:32am

Rix wrote: ↑Apr 19 2020 3:21pm
Got the 64T on and tested, still hit 38-39MPH, almost as fast as my old SurRon with the 55T sprocket which was a solid 39mph on the radar trailer. Thank you field weakening. And this will loop my ass over backwards if hit the throttle from start. Also got my high rise bars on. This was a huge difference, it makes the whole bike feel just a bit bigger.
I get a lot of calls from people asking which sprocket to get. I tell them that I have tried all of them and the 64t is my favorite.
It still does 35+ because the motor isn't loaded and revs more. I took off the 64t once and put on the stocker because I was
going to do some higher speed stuff. The stock 48 made the bike so slow (accelerating) that I hated it. It was such a pig.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 21 2020 9:49am

macribs wrote:
Apr 21 2020 2:05am
Rix wrote:
Apr 20 2020 9:36pm
macribs wrote:
Apr 20 2020 4:49pm
Rix wrote:
Apr 19 2020 5:21pm
Got the 64T on and tested, still hit 38-39MPH, almost as fast as my old SurRon with the 55T sprocket which was a solid 39mph on the radar trailer. Thank you field weakening. And this will loop my ass over backwards if hit the throttle from start. Also got my high rise bars on. This was a huge difference, it makes the whole bike feel just a bit bigger.

Image


That 64T looks like a perfect match. Have you gotten a chance to try it in the rough and up still climbs? You on stock controller btw?
Going to take it to "Carol Summit" this weekend and put it through the paces and see how it goes. I rode the green SurRon in this area before, but I didn't have the power to climb a couple of hills. With the X and 64T, I am betting I will.

I hope your knee is healing the right way and you are back to old self really soon. Nice to see you are back onto sur ron. That whole Alta situation and how it ended for Alta was sad really. Such a great product ending up on the shelf of can-am. Hopefully they will bring some cool EV's to the market based on the Alta.

Try to make a vid if you manage to climb stuff you previously didn't to try to put that 64T sprocket into context. Are you running the stock controller on the sur ron or have you upgraded?
I am running the stock "X" controller....for now. If my gopro battery still holds a charge, I will take it with me and make some hill climbing videos. One area I am looking at comparing was the one I rode with the 55T and 58T. But with those on, I had to help the bike up the climb. I don't think that will be the case with the 64t.

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Re: Sur-Ron - New Mid drive Bike

Post by Rix » Apr 21 2020 9:53am

crazy_dave wrote:
Apr 21 2020 8:14am
pipeking wrote:
Apr 20 2020 6:24am
Hey guys, having problems with my sur ron was wondering if anyone else has had similar issues?

Its cutting out, first few times was from a standstill there was nothing, but now its cutting out at full gas and dying... an unplug battery seems to fix it for about 5km then it quits again.

I have an x controller that was upgrade from the original controller, I am thinking about swapping it back on to see if this goes away.

sucks balls cos its sooo good for stealthing round during this lockdown bs
If you have already eliminated the brake and kickstand switches........
Get rid of the (tip-over) sensor. I had the same problem after I in stalled my X-controller. I thought I got my sensor right but that damn thing must be touchy. Kept randomly cutting out, eliminated the (tip-over) and have not had a problem since. Its tight under the controller and hard to get everything back exactly right.

Damn, never-mind, just saw that you removed it already. Long shot but....... You said that you have an older model. Is the motor compatible with the X-controller.
In the picture I posted above, can you see the lean angle sensor and point it out?

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