New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Discussions related to motors other than hub motors.
This includes R/C motors, botttom bracket, roller and geared drives.
sp1n4d0   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 20
Joined: Jun 13 2019 6:49pm

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by sp1n4d0 » Jun 15 2020 2:39pm

Retrorockit wrote:The bulge at the front of the top tube looks like it was made for the battery. It looks nice and organic. I think you were lucky to get it in there at all. I suppose you just charge it on the bike?
Yes, I charge the battery on the bike, too much work to unscrew the clamps everytime it needs juice.




casainho   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4496
Joined: Feb 14 2011 2:43pm

Re: New

Post by casainho » Jun 15 2020 3:11pm

sp1n4d0 wrote:
Jun 15 2020 2:39pm
Retrorockit wrote:The bulge at the front of the top tube looks like it was made for the battery. It looks nice and organic. I think you were lucky to get it in there at all. I suppose you just charge it on the bike?
Yes, I charge the battery on the bike, too much work to unscrew the clamps everytime it needs juice.
Why not developing a 3D print base for battery pack that can be easily attached to bike frames and make a battery quick and easily removable? I am not a mechanic but I think could be possible and would bring a lot of value. I have 4 TSDZ2 ebikes and recently I did a trip of 5 days with family and friends, 3 TSDZ2 ebikes and 1 commercial with Bosch battery - this one was good because was easy removable to charge on the places we slept: would be great to have a similar solution to TSDZ2!! Any mechanical user able to design / develop a 3D print base?

Image

My current project is to remove the 860C display from the handle bar and use a Garmin instead, which have advanced features like in advance identification of climbs:

Image
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of OpenSource knowledge and technology for ebikes: Wireless Ebike boar ANT+ and Bluetooth, Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation to help my developments: paypal.me/jorgecasa

chickenflex   1 µW

1 µW
Posts: 1
Joined: Jun 16 2020 2:53am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by chickenflex » Jun 16 2020 2:56am

Hi - looking at getting a TSDZ2 for my 29er to ease my winter commute.

I've tried a 36v 250w Shimano motor and that provided me with more than enough assistance during the commute.

I should be fine with getting the 48v 250w (road legal) version with something like 48V 11.4Ah Samsung 29E battery? My commute is around 20km each day.

I've been trying to read regarding the cadance - during my commute my cadance is usually around 95-100 rpm. Is this a problem?

casainho   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4496
Joined: Feb 14 2011 2:43pm

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by casainho » Jun 16 2020 3:00am

chickenflex wrote:
Jun 16 2020 2:56am
I've been trying to read regarding the cadance - during my commute my cadance is usually around 95-100 rpm. Is this a problem?
Not a problem with our developed OpenSource firmware where the max cadence limit is 120 RPM. The original firmware will not work for you, only our firmware: https://github.com/OpenSource-EBike-fir ... _wiki/wiki
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of OpenSource knowledge and technology for ebikes: Wireless Ebike boar ANT+ and Bluetooth, Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation to help my developments: paypal.me/jorgecasa

echew   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 49
Joined: May 19 2018 8:56pm

Re: New

Post by echew » Jun 16 2020 3:03am

andrewgateway wrote:
May 17 2020 2:29am

What grease did you use for the new blue gear?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
Sorry for the delay! I just used general automotive grease - I can't remember exactly which one, probably valvoline.

echew   100 mW

100 mW
Posts: 49
Joined: May 19 2018 8:56pm

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by echew » Jun 16 2020 3:16am

windburner wrote:
May 17 2020 2:16am

Thanks for the interesting use report on the brass gear. After hearing all of the blue gear destruction talk shortly after buying and installing our TSDZ2, I almost bought a brass gear to replace the blue preemptively, just to save some downstream frustration. I never did, and now certain to stay with the blue, as have seen several reports now of the noise, and, who wants shards!
Yes, good decision. I bought 2 more blue gears so that I have minimum downtime next time one breaks - postage from China to NZ takes a while and it's frustrating if you have to wait a couple of weeks with a broken e-bike!

sp1n4d0   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 20
Joined: Jun 13 2019 6:49pm

Re: New

Post by sp1n4d0 » Jun 16 2020 4:31am


casainho wrote: Why not developing a 3D print base for battery pack that can be easily attached to bike frames and make a battery quick and easily removable? I am not a mechanic but I think could be possible and would bring a lot of value. I have 4 TSDZ2 ebikes and recently I did a trip of 5 days with family and friends, 3 TSDZ2 ebikes and 1 commercial with Bosch battery - this one was good because was easy removable to charge on the places we slept: would be great to have a similar solution to TSDZ2!! Any mechanical user able to design / develop a 3D print base?
My battery have a base with quick release using a key, but I had to remove it because it didn't fit inside this bike frame.
My plan for the future is to build a box for a small triangle battery, and this one goes back to my hardtail bike.
Last year I made a 4 days trip, around 400km, maybe you know the route "Rota Vicentina", it was awesome!

casainho   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4496
Joined: Feb 14 2011 2:43pm

Re: New

Post by casainho » Jun 16 2020 5:32am

sp1n4d0 wrote:
Jun 16 2020 4:31am
casainho wrote: Why not developing a 3D print base for battery pack that can be easily attached to bike frames and make a battery quick and easily removable? I am not a mechanic but I think could be possible and would bring a lot of value. I have 4 TSDZ2 ebikes and recently I did a trip of 5 days with family and friends, 3 TSDZ2 ebikes and 1 commercial with Bosch battery - this one was good because was easy removable to charge on the places we slept: would be great to have a similar solution to TSDZ2!! Any mechanical user able to design / develop a 3D print base?
My battery have a base with quick release using a key, but I had to remove it because it didn't fit inside this bike frame.
My plan for the future is to build a box for a small triangle battery, and this one goes back to my hardtail bike.
Last year I made a 4 days trip, around 400km, maybe you know the route "Rota Vicentina", it was awesome!
I don´t need the lock, so only a base with a power connector would be enough. Here is the bicycle battery:

Image

Image

Image

Yes!! we did the "Rota Vicentina" on this last 5 days:
Image
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of OpenSource knowledge and technology for ebikes: Wireless Ebike boar ANT+ and Bluetooth, Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation to help my developments: paypal.me/jorgecasa

HrKlev   10 W

10 W
Posts: 82
Joined: Dec 06 2019 10:24am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by HrKlev » Jun 16 2020 7:04am

chickenflex wrote:
Jun 16 2020 2:56am
Hi - looking at getting a TSDZ2 for my 29er to ease my winter commute.

I've tried a 36v 250w Shimano motor and that provided me with more than enough assistance during the commute.

I should be fine with getting the 48v 250w (road legal) version with something like 48V 11.4Ah Samsung 29E battery? My commute is around 20km each day.

I've been trying to read regarding the cadance - during my commute my cadance is usually around 95-100 rpm. Is this a problem?
I have a battery like that (36V 11.4Ah with 10s4p 29e cells), and a 36V motor. With the firmware upgrade I am running it at 500W max. Im not using the bike for commuting, but I tested it on my commute the other day if, 15km each way and 200m elevation. 30-35 kmh on my singletrail bike with mud/gravel tires, so not effective at pavement at all.... Max assisitance all the way so I would not break sweat and ended up with 19% left after 30km total. 20km should be a breeze :)

ilu   10 W

10 W
Posts: 87
Joined: Oct 18 2019 10:51am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ilu » Jun 16 2020 7:54am

chickenflex wrote:
Jun 16 2020 2:56am
Hi - looking at getting a TSDZ2 for my 29er to ease my winter commute.

I've tried a 36v 250w Shimano motor and that provided me with more than enough assistance during the commute.

I should be fine with getting the 48v 250w (road legal) version with something like 48V 11.4Ah Samsung 29E battery? My commute is around 20km each day.

I've been trying to read regarding the cadance - during my commute my cadance is usually around 95-100 rpm. Is this a problem?
As casainho mentioned there'sno problem with the cadence if you use his OSF for SW102/850C/860C displays. If you prefer to use the original display and the OSF fork for them, it would be better to get a 36V motor and 48V battery. With "experimental high cadence mode" you'd still get SOME assist at 100 cadence, but only with casainhos firmware you can expect to have full power available.

Zamzoo   1 µW

1 µW
Posts: 3
Joined: May 28 2019 8:07am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by Zamzoo » Jun 17 2020 1:23am

Casainho and co, the latest firmware is absolutely fantastic, I didn’t realise how much I needed high cadence!

Really appreciate the street mode also.

I have two feature requests for consideration:

1 - independent options for speed and temperature display units. Being from the UK the natural units (for road users anyway) would be MPH and Celsius.

2 - the option to keep the SW102 screen at full brightness when the lights are on. I use my headlight in daylight for safety, but can’t read the display well at all when it dims.

Minor things, but would be the icing on the cake for this user.

Many thanks.

casainho   10 GW

10 GW
Posts: 4496
Joined: Feb 14 2011 2:43pm

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by casainho » Jun 17 2020 2:58am

Zamzoo wrote:
Jun 17 2020 1:23am
Casainho and co, the latest firmware is absolutely fantastic, I didn’t realise how much I needed high cadence!

Really appreciate the street mode also.

I have two feature requests for consideration:

1 - independent options for speed and temperature display units. Being from the UK the natural units (for road users anyway) would be MPH and Celsius.

2 - the option to keep the SW102 screen at full brightness when the lights are on. I use my headlight in daylight for safety, but can’t read the display well at all when it dims.

Minor things, but would be the icing on the cake for this user.
Thanks for the feedback!! Yes, I also love to have high cadence support up to 120 RPM!!

I am busy and I hope other developers can help develop that points, they are not big to develop considering current firmware state.
- TSDZ2 FAQ: issues and repairs, etc
- TSDZ2 OpenSource firmware

Developer of OpenSource knowledge and technology for ebikes: Wireless Ebike boar ANT+ and Bluetooth, Flexible OpenSource firmware for EBikes: TSDZ2 mid drive motor, KT motor controllers and displays: Bafang 850C color, SW102 Bluetooth and KT-LCD3.

If you like my work, please consider making a donation to help my developments: paypal.me/jorgecasa

fireflyer451   10 mW

10 mW
Posts: 21
Joined: Aug 28 2019 7:00am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by fireflyer451 » Jun 17 2020 3:03pm

Casainho - I read this in the current configuration settings: "WARNING: do not enable/use BOOST feature because it is currently buggy."

What is 'buggy' when Boost is enabled now? What would we see on our bikes?

thineight   100 W

100 W
Posts: 244
Joined: Oct 05 2018 3:53am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by thineight » Jun 17 2020 4:56pm

Quick one guys: do you know where to find the rubber seal of the new tsdz2 spider? I have a 2017 motor and that seal is bigger than the new's one.
I wonder where I can find the new version as I ordered the 104BCD spider but it comes without seal.
Thanks
MTB KTM Ultra 29" - City bike DAYTONA 28"

rosenbaaron   1 µW

1 µW
Posts: 4
Joined: Oct 22 2019 9:13pm

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by rosenbaaron » Jun 17 2020 6:07pm

I’m coming up on 3,500 miles. I applied new grease at 2,000 when I swapped blue gear. Is there any other recommended maintenance, should I regrease? I ask because it’s now hot in Texas and my motor seemed to lose power on my commute.

HrKlev   10 W

10 W
Posts: 82
Joined: Dec 06 2019 10:24am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by HrKlev » Jun 18 2020 1:56am

Sorry to repeat myself, but does anyone know if the hardware adjustment of the torque sensor described in the opensource firmware github will affect the pedals individually? I have a very unresponsive right pedal, so Im wondering if adjusting it would affect this, or if I have to get a new torque sensor...?

ilu   10 W

10 W
Posts: 87
Joined: Oct 18 2019 10:51am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ilu » Jun 18 2020 4:34am

thineight wrote:
Jun 17 2020 4:56pm
Quick one guys: do you know where to find the rubber seal of the new tsdz2 spider? I have a 2017 motor and that seal is bigger than the new's one.
I wonder where I can find the new version as I ordered the 104BCD spider but it comes without seal.
Thanks
This is the only seller I have found. But I also have an extra seal as I ordered two as spare parts. Do you still need the original bigger seal? I'd need one of those as I have a 130bcd spider in my other bike's motor and my makeshift seal didn't last very long. If you are located in Europe and want to trade the seals I'm happy to do it :)

thineight   100 W

100 W
Posts: 244
Joined: Oct 05 2018 3:53am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by thineight » Jun 18 2020 12:25pm

ilu wrote:
Jun 18 2020 4:34am
thineight wrote:
Jun 17 2020 4:56pm
Quick one guys: do you know where to find the rubber seal of the new tsdz2 spider? I have a 2017 motor and that seal is bigger than the new's one.
I wonder where I can find the new version as I ordered the 104BCD spider but it comes without seal.
Thanks
This is the only seller I have found. But I also have an extra seal as I ordered two as spare parts. Do you still need the original bigger seal? I'd need one of those as I have a 130bcd spider in my other bike's motor and my makeshift seal didn't last very long. If you are located in Europe and want to trade the seals I'm happy to do it :)
Hi, the link you posted seems to sell standard seals.. the ones you can find in any mechanical shop.
Specifically I was looking for the seal to put in this spider I bought, but not arrived yet (seal not supplied).
The spider 2017 version has a peculiar soft seal with lips and it is about 42mm OD.
This spider looks with a smaller seal (35mm OD) but I am not sure it will fit standard seals like the ones supplied with the motor or similar to the 2017 version.. but a bit smaller.
MTB KTM Ultra 29" - City bike DAYTONA 28"

ilu   10 W

10 W
Posts: 87
Joined: Oct 18 2019 10:51am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ilu » Jun 18 2020 2:40pm

thineight wrote:
Jun 18 2020 12:25pm
Hi, the link you posted seems to sell standard seals.. the ones you can find in any mechanical shop.
Specifically I was looking for the seal to put in this spider I bought, but not arrived yet (seal not supplied).
The spider 2017 version has a peculiar soft seal with lips and it is about 42mm OD.
This spider looks with a smaller seal (35mm OD) but I am not sure it will fit standard seals like the ones supplied with the motor or similar to the 2017 version.. but a bit smaller.
I though those spiders would fit the same seal as the 2017 motor as some sellers claim that they fit "older motor only". I have the 130bcd spider as in your link and the hole in it is 38mm, which I didn't realize when I ordered it. There's also another type of 104bcd spider (grey aluminium) that fits the standard 28mm seal that comes with newer motors.

bdidier   1 µW

1 µW
Posts: 4
Joined: Jul 03 2019 8:49am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by bdidier » Jun 18 2020 3:58pm

Hello everyone,

This is my first post on the forum!

I have been reading a lot on this forum to be ready for any issue with the TSDZ2 but I have see this specific problem on the forum before

I have been using my TSDZ2 for 1.5 years without any problem and 1500 km, but yesterday the motor stop providing assistance with a E08 (low battery) error on the display.

I am using the stock firmware.

The 48v battery was fully loaded at 54v

I have tested the TSDZ2 by providing the power directly from the charger it has the same issue

When I use the walk assist I get a click and a little buzz from the motor/controller

The next day when I tried again the error was gone and the display was showing full battery but the issue remain.

I guess my best chance to solve this issue is to replace the controller as I suspect it has gone bad

What do you think about it?

Many thanks

thineight   100 W

100 W
Posts: 244
Joined: Oct 05 2018 3:53am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by thineight » Jun 18 2020 5:39pm

ilu wrote:
Jun 18 2020 2:40pm

I though those spiders would fit the same seal as the 2017 motor as some sellers claim that they fit "older motor only". I have the 130bcd spider as in your link and the hole in it is 38mm, which I didn't realize when I ordered it. There's also another type of 104bcd spider (grey aluminium) that fits the standard 28mm seal that comes with newer motors.
So, how did you seal your 38mm hole? I expect my 104BCD will arrive with the same hole. I wonder if there is any 38ODx15ID compatible seal.
MTB KTM Ultra 29" - City bike DAYTONA 28"

ilu   10 W

10 W
Posts: 87
Joined: Oct 18 2019 10:51am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ilu » Jun 18 2020 6:27pm

thineight wrote:
Jun 18 2020 5:39pm
So, how did you seal your 38mm hole? I expect my 104BCD will arrive with the same hole. I wonder if there is any 38ODx15ID compatible seal.
I glued some rubber to the spider and made a hole in the center, and put a cable inlet type of gasket on the axle, the rubber in the groove of the inlet. But it wore out after some thousand kms. I took a closer look at the spider (and removed the glue), the outer groove is 41mm diameter, so I'd think your seal will fit if the lips are 42mm and there's a groove in the middle.
Attachments
IMG_20200619_021913_1.jpg
IMG_20200619_021913_1.jpg (262.29 KiB) Viewed 368 times

ilu   10 W

10 W
Posts: 87
Joined: Oct 18 2019 10:51am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ilu » Jun 18 2020 6:39pm

But beware, at least my spider was not a perfect fit. I had some play in the axle which is difficult to eliminate completely, as discussed before in this thread. Thus the spider rubbed against the outer plastic cover of the main gear, and both the spider and the edge of the cover are worn out. I noticed this early and tried to add thin spacers between the spider and the main gear, but this in turn broke the sprag clutch as the spider did not support the plastic cover of the clutch.
Attachments
IMG_20200619_023207.jpg
IMG_20200619_023207.jpg (402.96 KiB) Viewed 362 times

sysrq   100 W

100 W
Posts: 164
Joined: May 07 2018 6:05pm

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by sysrq » Jun 18 2020 8:17pm

ilu wrote:
Jun 18 2020 6:39pm
But beware, at least my spider was not a perfect fit. I had some play in the axle which is difficult to eliminate completely, as discussed before in this thread. Thus the spider rubbed against the outer plastic cover of the main gear, and both the spider and the edge of the cover are worn out. I noticed this early and tried to add thin spacers between the spider and the main gear, but this in turn broke the sprag clutch as the spider did not support the plastic cover of the clutch.
How can this brake the sprag clutch? Some who are using 2mm spacers between the main gear and the spider as a requirement to mount two chain rings might expect the failure of the sprag clutch then.

ilu   10 W

10 W
Posts: 87
Joined: Oct 18 2019 10:51am

Re: New "TSDZ2 Torque Sensor Central Motor"

Post by ilu » Jun 18 2020 10:46pm

sysrq wrote:
Jun 18 2020 8:17pm
How can this brake the sprag clutch? Some who are using 2mm spacers between the main gear and the spider as a requirement to mount two chain rings might expect the failure of the sprag clutch then.
Well I can't be sure if it was because of the gap or if the clutch was faulty, but soon after I changed the spider my sprag clutch started slipping and I noticed that the plastic part that is holding the clutch rollers was coming out and was broken. So it seemed that it broke because the spider was not pressing against it. Might also be that because of the gap some dirt was getting in.

Post Reply