MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

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litespeed   100 kW

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by litespeed » Apr 05 2017 4:52pm

I have a 6T MXUS in a 17" rim and ran it with a Lyen 18 FET at 24s or 88 volts. Had huge amounts of torque but topped off at around 40 to 43mph depending on state of charge.

For the power you want in a non heating motor you will have to do a minimum of a QS 205 5T or less with Hubsinks and ferrofluid on 20s or as Maddin88 said and go 2 wheel drive. The heating part is what you will have issues with on low voltages lugging that motor assuming you need 150 Nms because of a heavy load/lot of weight.

Hub motor will die in high amp/high torque low RPM environments. The 26" wheel is a killer as well. Small wheels effectively raise RPM which makes motors happier and cooler running. If you could do a 17 or 18" wheel and big 3 or 4" tire would that work?

A mid drive might do that torque for you on the voltage you have but not for sure....BBSHD? I know a Tangent Drive will meet your specs but they are quite pricey but well worth it in my opinion.

Tom
I'm married so you know I'm no stranger to pain!

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by madin88 » Apr 06 2017 9:33am

rumme wrote: I guess moving up to a 60 volt - 50-60 amp output wont make much of a difference either and that 72 volts would be needed for the high torque - 35 MPH top speed goal on a 26 inch direct drive hub motor ?
as you want to have 150Nm of torque, it would mean you will see roughly about 2000-3000W copper losses when using hub motors like the MXUS.
A 2WD MAC drive will produce about 300-400W of heat at 75Nm each, so in total below 800W.

The 2WD drive has lower weight (~4kg each motor).
easier and more durable lacing into fat bike rim + better suspension/handling beacuse of lower unsprung mass
MUCH longer battery life
pretty sure no problem with overheating.
two cheap 48V 30-40A controllers will be enough.

The BBS HD would be for sure also a good decision, however, two MAC's will eat it too :mrgreen:
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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by DAND214 » Apr 06 2017 9:58am

That's a lot of torque! Are you towing a bus :mrgreen: Have you used this? http://www.ebikes.ca/tools/simulator.html I can't even get close with the options listed.

Dan

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by rumme » Apr 06 2017 10:19am

DAND214 wrote:That's a lot of torque! Are you towing a bus :mrgreen: Have you used this? http://www.ebikes.ca/tools/simulator.html I can't even get close with the options listed.

Dan
I purchased a Bafang 750 watt geared hub motor, that is rated to have 80 Nms of torque on 48 volts- 750 watts. I pumped 2300 watts into { 50 volts 54 amps} and I thought the torque was still pathetic. I'm trying to guess, how much NMs of torque, is need to have the ability to raise the front end from a stand still, when the throttle is punched. Is this type of hi torque even possible, in a 26" wheel, on a 48 volt - 50-60 amp setup ? Once again, 30 mph top speed, is good enough, as long as the torque is impressive. I understand to get a hi torque and hi top speed, can be difficult, but I thought it would be easier to get hi torque and a lower top speed from 48 volt- 50 amp setup.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by madin88 » Apr 06 2017 10:35am

rumme wrote:but I thought it would be easier to get hi torque and a lower top speed from 48 volt- 50 amp setup.
as mentioned, at 150Nm the MXUS will be close to saturation and it will produce plenty of heat.

if you like to lift the front wheel, than forget the 2WD drive.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by DAND214 » Apr 06 2017 10:36am

Before I weighed down my bike with tools and spare parts on the top tube, I did sit on the ground a couple times. MAC and 15s LiPo. Fat bikes are much heavier in frt than a normal MTB. You want to lift the frt wheel? Put a rack on back and mount the batteries there, you will sit on the ground a few times before you master it :mrgreen:

Dan

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by rumme » Apr 06 2017 10:56am

DAND214 wrote:Before I weighed down my bike with tools and spare parts on the top tube, I did sit on the ground a couple times. MAC and 15s LiPo. Fat bikes are much heavier in frt than a normal MTB. You want to lift the frt wheel? Put a rack on back and mount the batteries there, you will sit on the ground a few times before you master it :mrgreen:

Dan
Actually, doing wheelies does not interest me, but I figure the ability to raise the front end, under throttle, is 1 example of very good torque ratings. Some people are more interested in a high top speed, others are interested in a hi top speed and hi torque. I'm just interested in 30-35 mph top speed, and high torque, so I thought it would not be that hard to achieve with a MXUS or LEAF motor on 48 volts- 50-60 amp setup in a 26 inch wheel.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by macribs » Apr 06 2017 5:15pm

Well if I you weren't running fat bike wheels I would say the easiest way to boost torque would be to use smaller rear wheel. 16" or 17".
Maybe you can settle for motorcycle 16" or 17" with a 4" or 5" tire? If you go to e-simulator over at ebikes.ca you can play around with various scenarios and simulations.

If you already got the battery and are not ready to up the voltage you could look into tangentdrive, with a 32xx Astro motor. Par the astro with a tough ESC and you will have all the torque you ever need. Or maybe the Davinci drive from Recumpence?

If you are really set on using 26" fat bikes wheel in the rear, a mid drive might the only reasonable thing to give you the torque you are looking for. There are many options. From the top of my head Joby, Golden motor, Q100/Q150 from Hacker, and not to forget the small and nimble Torcman CPD if they are still around. There is thread about the tiny and lightweight Torcman here. Motor is shipping with a gearbox so you can mount on swing arm and runs chain straight to rear sprocket.

Also if you choose mid drive you have various torque/speed via cassette or even IGH, or if run like a left side you can easily swap sprockets to change torque, or speed to find what suits you the best.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Sergiocielo » Apr 09 2017 1:57am

rumme wrote:
To make the question easier, I guess I'm looking for the least expensive route to 35 MPH top speed with exceptional torque { 150 Nms or more} using a direct drive hub motor on a 48 volt battery and a 50-60 amp output lyen controller , without worrying about overheating issues in the motor.

I completely agree with madim 88.
The motor's torque declared by producers is only valid to achieve marketing's goals in fact when you ask Bosh as well as to or others to have motor's bench dinamometric test and/or precise technical data they give nothing as well as Shimano for example gives no permissible torque in input of its gearbox. This is commercial practise, guarantee policy due to the reason that techical data given correspond to opposable truth.
150 Nm at the driving wheel is an relatively important torque so that if it is easy to say that DD motor like you said it can give is not the same to say that it can guarantee in S1 service that means continuative service and, if you need to discuss about services S2 or S9, you will understand that answer becames almost impossible.
To achieve your goal you must ask for a bigger power motor but efficiency will be not the best.
However this is the strategy commonly used in automotive but this strategy is no efficient regarding save energy and pollution while other solution are possible on the respect of these imperatives.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by markz » Apr 09 2017 1:44pm

MXUS 3kw v2 or v3 is your motor. Get the turn count to best suit your needs.
I'm looking for the least expensive route to 35 MPH top speed with exceptional torque { 150 Nms or more} using a direct drive hub motor on a 48 volt battery and a 50-60 amp output lyen controller , without worrying about overheating issues in the motor.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Rix » Apr 09 2017 3:03pm

markz wrote:MXUS 3kw v2 or v3 is your motor. Get the turn count to best suit your needs.
I'm looking for the least expensive route to 35 MPH top speed with exceptional torque { 150 Nms or more} using a direct drive hub motor on a 48 volt battery and a 50-60 amp output lyen controller , without worrying about overheating issues in the motor.
I can personally attest that the 4T on 18s with no field weakening (no increased PWR Timing and OVS on MAX E) will go about 38MPH tops HOC which is 73 volts for my conservatively set HVC. This is with a MC wheel with an OD of about 24.5 inches. If I was spinning a 26 or 27.5 MTB wheel, maybe another 1.5 MPH. I also know another guy using a non sinwave controller getting 42 MPH with out of his 4T with 20s running 83 volts HOC. That is with a 26MTB wheel. To get to 35MPH with MXUS on 48 volts, Sergio will need a 3T wind for sure.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Sergiocielo » Apr 10 2017 10:54am

April 07, 2017. In Mxus we have tested a standard 198 mm stator OD (51 slots-46 magnets) with 3 turns of windings instead of the previous 4 turns by which this motor's structure has achieved 651.6 rpm unloaded as already written with good curves and 48 V. This new sample has achieved about 835 rpm but as the attached dino-test shows, after initial instability it gives no more data below 637 rpm because of the motor stop. Have you an explaination for this?
Is it impossibile with 46 magnets and 51 slots to achieve more than 650 rpm with good curves at 48 V due to back fem or what?
Thanks
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^89649029D57A196E9C67259A052ECC7FD2E02BDADF3025C0A8^pimgpsh_fullsize_distr.jpg
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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by madin88 » Apr 10 2017 11:08am

Sergiocielo wrote:April 07, 2017. In Mxus we have tested a standard 198 mm stator OD (51 slots-46 magnets) with 3 turns of windings instead of the previous 4 turns by which this motor's structure has achieved 651.6 rpm unloaded as already written with good curves and 48 V. This new sample has achieved about 835 rpm but as the attached dino-test shows, after initial instability it gives no more data below 637 rpm because of the motor stop. Have you an explaination for this?
Is it impossibile with 46 magnets and 51 slots to achieve more than 650 rpm with good curves at 48 V due to back fem or what?
Thanks
why there is such large voltage drop (number 32 in the sheet)?
It looks like an overcurrent protection of a BMS.

94% efficiency would be nice, but probabaly a wrong result due to the cut off :)
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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by korpin » Apr 25 2017 12:57pm

hey guys....as i say that,my wrist is NOT limp :lol: i have a MXUS motor that i had an unusual incident: the brake disc screw came loose and took out all my wiring-I do not have a great solder gun and the expertise to re wire so i would like to sell it,for lets say 100.00 plus shipping....before the incident it worked fine except the heat sensor never gave the right temperature from day one will have photo of insides pretty soon..... the motor will come with new shell and covering because i am going to just swap out and my covers are vented i want to keep them
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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by markz » Apr 25 2017 1:53pm

That is for the "For Sale" section, and when you place your ad there, please be sure to add your location and optional shipping price.

Rewiring it is actually easy, your hall sensors should be intact, and hopefully the wires are decent so you dont have to open it up, just snip, strip, slip on heat shrink, buy a $10 Radio Shack soldering gun, 60/40 solder, wire and you are good to go, use a lighter to shrink the heat shrink and you are good to go.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by korpin » Apr 25 2017 2:26pm

markz wrote:That is for the "For Sale" section, and when you place your ad there, please be sure to add your location and optional shipping price.

Rewiring it is actually easy, your hall sensors should be intact, and hopefully the wires are decent so you dont have to open it up, just snip, strip, slip on heat shrink, buy a $10 Radio Shack soldering gun, 60/40 solder, wire and you are good to go, use a lighter to shrink the heat shrink and you are good to go.
oh sorry i am in los angeles....well the wires were cut pretty short so I think the correct way would be to wire all the way back to beginning

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Rix » May 26 2017 8:52pm

Too bad its not the MXUS 5k, would be bidding

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by markz » May 27 2017 1:46pm

430 euro laced rim with tire and "May not post to Canada" $650cad/$480usd
What was the shipping price on that from Ireland?

I bought a used rim 16 x 1.60 on an online classified Kijiji for $50 and I just measured the spoke holes to be ~6.1mm and Holmes is selling 17" x 1.60 with 6.25mm spoke holes so I think I got a not bad deal. Any rim on ebay is $100+
so I am keeping a close eye on Kijiji now, looking for 17 x 1.60/1.85 and 18 x 1.60/1.85. Just measured a regular bicycle rims spoke holes and its 4.3mm. So Im gunna lace my MXUS 3kw V2 4T into the 16 x 1.60 moto rim and throw on a Sunko tire.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Rix » May 27 2017 6:20pm

markz wrote:430 euro laced rim with tire and "May not post to Canada" $650cad/$480usd
What was the shipping price on that from Ireland?

I bought a used rim 16 x 1.60 on an online classified Kijiji for $50 and I just measured the spoke holes to be ~6.1mm and Holmes is selling 17" x 1.60 with 6.25mm spoke holes so I think I got a not bad deal. Any rim on ebay is $100+
so I am keeping a close eye on Kijiji now, looking for 17 x 1.60/1.85 and 18 x 1.60/1.85. Just measured a regular bicycle rims spoke holes and its 4.3mm. So Im gunna lace my MXUS 3kw V2 4T into the 16 x 1.60 moto rim and throw on a Sunko tire.
Hey Mark, I got a 17x1.40 Polished aluminum Prowheel racing rim I will give your for the price of shipping. Its used of course. Its set up to you use 6.4mm to 7mm spoke nipples. I had it laced to my 5404 with 8G spokes and 7mm x 18mm spoke nipples. PM me if interested.

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test to see if reply fixes broken thread

Post by amberwolf » Jun 17 2017 2:10am

test to see if reply fixes broken thread

EDIT: Nope, still broken, only first page is visible; it doesn't even know there are pages past the first one, and thinks there are only 2 posts in it at all.

EDIT2: now it sees 3 posts in this thread, presumably because of this one, but it still doesn't show anything but page one (of multiple pages)

Can only edit this post by putting in the URL for editing a post (copied from another thread that does work) and pasting the post number in. Can only view any posts past the first page by doing a search on stuff in this thread title or viewing my own posts to see that it's in there, etc.


Edit3 (12-27-17): Mark5 fixed the thread (presumably by copying it to a new one as suggested elsewhere?)
Last edited by amberwolf on Dec 28 2017 12:47am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Rix » Jun 25 2017 10:58am

Has anyone experienced what kind of difference in power the V3 has over the V2 same winds?

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by redline2097 » Jun 29 2017 12:15am

Hmmm, where all are the posts? There were like tens of pages and now the latest is from 2004. :O

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Rix » Jun 30 2017 8:47pm

Posted this question before, and then it vanished like a virgin on prom night. Has anyone done a side by side comparison between the V2 4T and the V3 4T same phase amps and volts input? I am of the impression V3 would pull harder, be more efficient, and do all that with only slightly more eddy resistance due to better magnets and slightly larger phase wires because of the bigger axle. Can anyone confirm?

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Offroader » Jul 10 2017 10:54am

What happened to the rest of this MXUS thread? Seems like a lot of posts lost? Was trying to look back at some old posts for some settings I wrote.

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Re: MXUS 3000 Hub Motor - V1 V2 V3

Post by Rix » Jul 11 2017 7:47am

bump again

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